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 08-30-2012, 05:54 PM         #61
kevante 
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 Kadillac87 said:
Are you serious? You really want to get into a pissing match about your degree?



[pic - click to view]




From a top 5 engineering program. Don't even try it with me son. I think I would know




And yes, decay is a measurable rate. All measurable rates depend on a constant. That constant is a.ssumed to be constant throughout the entire process. You're gonna tell me we have observed U-238 for over 4 billion years to determine it's half-life when we only known about radioactivity for a little over 100? Clearly, it is relying on a HUGE a.ssumption.

And yes, gravity is scientific fact but it is not a fact. It's a theory. At one point, the Earth being flat was considered a scientific fact. At one point, the Earth being the center of the universe was considered scientific fact. Scientific facts are not absolute truths and are subject to change. So wouldn't it be illogical to say science, in it's ever changing state, disproves or discredits something?
Wait you're arguing for Creationism, and then in the same breath claiming that Radioactive decay is an a.ssumption because we haven't observed it? The irony of that statement!

Rate of decay is observable(even without witnessing firsthand it's entire timeline being played out), we don't need to see something with our eyes to know it exists. We don't need to see dinosaurs to know they were real, we don't need to touch the sun to know it's hot, we don't need to take a deep breath in space to know we can breathe there. We are able to observe the constant rate of decay, therefore we can map out it's effect. By your logic, nothing that came before us or nothing that lasts forever(or seemingly forever), can be a fact because it cannot be observed....think about that for a second.

If you REALLY are a nuclear engineering major....really....but if you really are...you have got to be a freshman or sophomore, if you honestly think that the observable constant rate is a HUGE a.ssumption. How can you observe something which goes on forever?

The world being flat was NEVER and I repeat NEVER a scientific fact. You're talking about a time before science, the scientific method, and the concept of scientific fact.




To be clear, I'm not a religion bashing Atheist. I was raised Catholic most of my life, and am open minded enough to believe that we may have been "created" somehow, as part of some intelligent design. But Creationism is an ancient fairy tale for little kids and rednecks who are afraid to think about "scary" concepts outside of their religion. And I understand that, because I was once one of those kids, and it was a very scary and confusing time for me when I began to question my faith. As of now, I would say I'm not religious, don't believe in any one single religious establishment, and might classify myself as Agnostic. Questioning what you're told to believe is OK, and if the answers they give you don't add up, well...that's up to you.


Last edited by kevante; 08-30-2012 at 06:03 PM..
 5 years ago '10        #62
TheMindOf 21 heat pts21
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 Kadillac87 said:
What animal is Job 40: 15-24 describing?

“Look at Behemoth,
which I made along with you
and which feeds on grass like an ox.
16 What strength it has in its loins,
what power in the muscles of its belly!
17 Its tail sways like a cedar;
the sinews of its thighs are close-knit.
18 Its bones are tubes of bronze,
its limbs like rods of iron.
19 It ranks first among the works of God,
yet its Maker can approach it with his sword.
20 The hills bring it their produce,
and all the wild animals play nearby.
21 Under the lotus plants it lies,
hidden among the reeds in the marsh.
22 The lotuses conceal it in their shadow;
the poplars by the stream surround it.
23 A raging river does not alarm it;
it is secure, though the Jordan should surge against its mouth.
24 Can anyone capture it by the eyes,
or trap it and pierce its nose?

Even your own evidence says it's a possible reference to dinosaurs.

Behemoth (and then the sea-monster Leviathan who is also described) are used in a parable told to demonstrate the power of God. They are admittedly mythical characters who nobody had actually seen and are only used and described in this one story.

In this scripture, these are one-off animals. Doesn't make sense because it's been proven that dinosaurs were all over in their time. Not just mysterious mythical creatures who only God cold tame or had access to.

There is no mention of people casually living with dinosaurs in the Bible. Which would have had to have been the case.

Now I don't know about you, but if people of that time were casually sharing the earth with these creatures


[pic - click to view]



Im no genius, but I think there would be a little more than a vague mythical reference to such..
 5 years ago '04        #63
flip_20001trini 3 heat pts
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watch the new katt williams special he /thread on this topic
 5 years ago '08        #64
stlcardinals19 32 heat pts32
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 Screwhead said:


Good man.
Why Thank you.


Those challenges need to be appealed, as well as the challenges stopping children (on their own) from practicing their religious beliefs on school grounds.

Parents should also take their children out of those schools, if they disagree with the procedures.

But with "public" (government) schools being a Communist ideology, it's no surprise children/parents have something FORCED on them no matter what.
I believe they are, but in Texas' case, their state school board is instrumental in schoolbooks, and their recent ruling to sway materials towards Christian beliefs are going to be put in schoolbooks across the country. It might take a while to get these things reversed, but in the meantime these materials will have to be used across the nation. I don't think that's right.


Personal, private, non-violent, everyday decisions?

No, they shouldn't be questioned.

Not unless you want to intrude into someone else's personal affairs.


You, me, Bill Nye, or anyone else questioning those decisions (beliefs, in this case) is not knowledgeable enough of the afterlife to definitively know the answers.
Nah, I'm more of referring those decisions made in the ballot box when issues like Gay Marriage is put up. If the reason they voted no is b/c of the Word of God and not b/c of a harmful effect it might cause, then I think that sort of thinking should be questioned. I just feel they should vote as a rights-loving American as opposed to a Christian.



"Christian-run" adopting agencies are the only local/State options?
Unfortunately in So. Illinois, where they live, I'm afraid so.



Fully knowing they (like anyone else) don't know the makeup of the afterlife, to question anyone religiously (and peacefully) believing what they choose.
I'll give you that one


No, it just pisses people off, causes more instability/anger amongst fellow Americans, and continues tearing down our Constitutional Rights.

Reading/researching the religious doctrine(s) and refuting claims of "believers" with quoted passages is the most effective way.

Being ideologues of the same fascistic nature doesn't solve anything; it makes things worse, and makes hypocrites of the detractors.
Well, i don't really know what else they can do to get their point across. The Christian/Muslim belief is holding them back, and the only way, as of now is to make those beliefs a non-legit leg to stand on to discriminate. I've tried to reason w/some folks on here that the Bible's concept of homos3xuality bears nothing to Homos3xuality today, and to look @ it context of their time, but they just don't want to hear it, my man. There's just gonna be a point where you stop trying to reasonably counter-act and just try to take the whole book down.


Anyone impressing a definitive answer onto someone else is who has the burden of proof.

Religious/spiritual or Atheist.
Agreed.

There is no Right to marry in the Constitution for anyone, homos3xual or straight. That is why the States & State Citizens have authority to decide these matters.

Homos3xuals can start their own churches/religious centers, or their own adoptive agencies.....that would be taking charge of the situation.

If you want something done right, do it yourself.


Or at the very least, sue the State to allow for equal treatment of adoptive procedures.


Being proactive not only gets things done, but preserves the Rule of Law.
I don't really like having the rights of the minority left in the hands of the majority. I just don't see any sort of good in that. And though it's not a Constitutional right, there's been precedent that it's a Government institution as opposed to a religious one, and I'm just not seeing states, namely ones in the South making any sort of action towards those folks. I just don't. As you can tell, those who believe in God, Christians mainly have left kind of a mark on my fam, so I get a little bit antsy towards religious folks
 5 years ago '08        #65
stlcardinals19 32 heat pts32
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 flip_20001trini said:
watch the new katt williams special he /thread on this topic
...........no he didn't, he basically said why haven't monkeys evolved into humans, and lost any sort of steam there.
 5 years ago '07        #66
JordanWest86 23 heat pts23
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 TheMindOf said:


Not sure what that's actually from, but there is NO mention of dinosaurs ANYWHERE in the actual bible.

Please, tell me what verse in the Bible, this accompanies

I'll wait.


This is a list of all of the animals mentioned in the bible




You mean to tell me that of all the Animals that existed, they somehow forgot dinosaurs .



Really?


[pic - click to view]



They forgot all of these guys.

Once again the bible isnt an animal encyclopedia my friend. Why does it have to mention them? I still dont understand your simple thinking. Wheres a beatle, a wasp, a SHARK? There are sooooo many kinds of sharks. But they must not have existed back then I guess would be your thinking?

Really doesnt matter though I mean no ones gonna change your mind. You can take the Bible as history that could be true or you can just a.ssume all kinds of other stuff happened. I mean a.ssumption never k!lled anyone. Ohhhhhh dont tell that to asbestos victims
 5 years ago '06        #67
nightmare 429 heat pts429
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 Kadillac87 said:
Where in the Bible does it say the Earth's exact age? It doesn't. It's an a.ssumption. How do you think scientist determined the age of the Earth? It's determined by radioactive dating which is also, based on an a.ssumptions. Radioactivity was discovered a little over a 100 years ago, but yet we a.ssume we know how it decayed billions of years prior? How can you say something based on a.ssumptions discredits something else based on a.ssumptions?

Do you not realize most of all scientific methods relie on a simple a.ssumption?
 5 years ago '06        #68
nightmare 429 heat pts429
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 The Fifth KD said:
Perfect my a.ss.

70% of this planet is uninhabitable by humans.

Meteor strikes wiped out entire species.

Natural disasters decimate entire countries yearly.

And that's from geological/meteorological perspective.

When looking from a biology perspective, diseases, birth defects, disabilities and other run rampant in all families of the biota kingdom.

And from an astronomical perspective, what the fu*k are the other planets in our solar system then? Was god just fu*king around with making them and said "ehhhh i guess Ill make this ONE PLANET habitable by living organisms and the other ones will just be there so humans can have sh*t to look at in space" ?

People can't live with the (probable) fact that life is a happy accident. We just have to be "special".
 5 years ago '11        #69
Kadillac87 225 heat pts225
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 kevante said:
Wait you're arguing for Creationism, and then in the same breath claiming that Radioactive decay is an a.ssumption because we haven't observed it? The irony of that statement!

Rate of decay is observable(even without witnessing firsthand it's entire timeline being played out), we don't need to see something with our eyes to know it exists. We don't need to see dinosaurs to know they were real, we don't need to touch the sun to know it's hot, we don't need to take a deep breath in space to know we can breathe there. We are able to observe the constant rate of decay, therefore we can map out it's effect. By your logic, nothing that came before us or nothing that lasts forever(or seemingly forever), can be a fact because it cannot be observed....think about that for a second.

If you REALLY are a nuclear engineering major....really....but if you really are...you have got to be a freshman or sophomore, if you honestly think that the observable constant rate is a HUGE a.ssumption. How can you observe something which goes on forever?

The world being flat was NEVER and I repeat NEVER a scientific fact. You're talking about a time before science, the scientific method, and the concept of scientific fact.




To be clear, I'm not a religion bashing Atheist. I was raised Catholic most of my life, and am open minded enough to believe that we may have been "created" somehow, as part of some intelligent design. But Creationism is an ancient fairy tale for little kids and rednecks who are afraid to think about "scary" concepts outside of their religion. And I understand that, because I was once one of those kids, and it was a very scary and confusing time for me when I began to question my faith. As of now, I would say I'm not religious, don't believe in any one single religious establishment, and might classify myself as Agnostic. Questioning what you're told to believe is OK, and if the answers they give you don't add up, well...that's up to you.

I'm not arguing for creationism. I'm saying they both rely on a.ssumptions. The only difference is what they are called. Some people call their a.ssumptions faith and others call their a.ssumptions scientific fact. You can't say my a.ssumptions proved your a.ssumptions wrong just because you call it something different.

Yes, you can observe decay. We have only observed it for about 100 years and used this small fraction of time to model how it behaved billion of years ago. Yes, that is an a.ssumption because we can't prove how something decayed billion of years ago. We can only make the reasonable a.ssumption that it is pretty constant over long period of time. Can I observe a car going 55 MPH for 10 mins and a.ssume it will be going 55 MPH 10 hours later? That's what we are essentially doing. The statistical law for radioactive decay a.ssume the decay constant does not depend on time or number of atoms present. Show many any reputable source that doesn't state this a.ssumption.

And no, I'm not a freshman or sophomore. I already have my degree. Decay a.ssumptions are very basic concepts. It's not on the level of using intertial confinement to create fusion energy with Deuterium and Tritium.
 5 years ago '11        #70
Kadillac87 225 heat pts225
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 TheMindOf said:
Behemoth (and then the sea-monster Leviathan who is also described) are used in a parable told to demonstrate the power of God. They are admittedly mythical characters who nobody had actually seen and are only used and described in this one story.

In this scripture, these are one-off animals. Doesn't make sense because it's been proven that dinosaurs were all over in their time. Not just mysterious mythical creatures who only God cold tame or had access to.

There is no mention of people casually living with dinosaurs in the Bible. Which would have had to have been the case.

Now I don't know about you, but if people of that time were casually sharing the earth with these creatures


[pic - click to view]



Im no genius, but I think there would be a little more than a vague mythical reference to such..
Exactly the response I expected. No matter what evidence is presented, you will try to debunk it because you already have your mind made up. Isn't this the same thing you guys say about people who believe in God?

 5 years ago '11        #71
Kadillac87 225 heat pts225
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 nightmare said:
Show me where I'm wrong.
 5 years ago '05        #72
Andrefrbk 1067 heat pts1067 OP
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I really dont want to continue this discussion anymore, there are a lot of ignorant close minded religious/godly sentiments in this biitch. If you haven't taken any biology, or evolution courses. And you are a uni student i suggest you take a 101.

This will probably be my final rant. Im truly annoyed with some of the comments that continue to say "there could be a god..." "There is a god".

To say you believe in god and you know there is a god etc. Is absolutely absurd. It shows your lack of ability to rationalize, and think critically.

Religion and their God(s) created an easy way for individuals to avoid doing any thinking for themselves. Why ask questions, why look for answers, just say that god did/will do it and fuk off with sciences. This is why you cannot believe in god(s) you are doing yourself an injustice.

The Scientific Method allows you to form a question or hypothesis, AND TEST IT. After the results you choose to accept it, or falsify based on your observations from the tests. If you have a hypothesis like "Did god create the world we live in, along with its inhabitants." How can you test this? You simply cannot, therefor WHY WASTE YOUR FUKING TIME believing something you cannot test, or observe for yourself? ITS STUPID, ITS FUKING DUMB, YOUR WASTING YOUR BRAIN CELLS.

If we were all stupid fuking religious god thrusting morons... Science wouldn't exist, we wouldn't have any answers to the tough questions. We would still think that the earth is the center of the solar system. And i shiit you not n*ggas in ancient times believed "God" placed us in the center. WRONG WRONG, FUKING MOTHER FUKING WRONG. Religion and god is all bullshiit, it limits free thinking, an inhibits the human brain from thinking critically.

Do you know how easy it is to look at the stars and say... I wonder where stars come from? God made em. Fuking hell man.
Now on to evolution...

YOU CAN TEST EVOLUTION, YOU CAN WITNESS EVOLUTION. There are many ways to show evolution is obviously on the right track to figuring out this thing called LIFE.
We have physical evidence, fossil records... We can test these, there are many many method you can test to find the Age of fossil... With genetic testing we have managed to go even further. Anatomy again, Another fuking test. This is hard work testing, but its rewarding you know why... Because you find the fuking truth. You test test test, falsify and accept.

NO ONE, can test if "God" created all you see. But we can test evolutionary theories. And we have accepted it. By we the scientific community, because there is evidence, you can observe it with your fuking eyes.

If you pray to god(s) and say god(s) created "insert object, thing" what ever. You are wasting your time on this earth. The human race does not need you, we need people we are going to question, test, and help us evolve technologically. So we can improve life, because we only have 5 billion years left before the sun blows up.<NOT JOKING. So lets cut the bullshiit, and stop playing around with fairy tales and mystical stories. Lets get real, with facts, and intellectual notions, things we can test.

Stop following a religion, be your own person, dont let a book/deity/being what ever, control your life. THINK MAN, FUKING THINK. USE YOUR BRAIN. Sit down one day, write down 10 questions about anything. Google it... See how many list god in their sources.

[video - click to view]



Last edited by Andrefrbk; 08-30-2012 at 08:17 PM..
 5 years ago '06        #73
nightmare 429 heat pts429
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 Kadillac87 said:
Show me where I'm wrong.
i was, but kevante and that other dude already took the words out of my mouth
 5 years ago '06        #74
nightmare 429 heat pts429
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 Andrefrbk said:
I really dont want to continue this discussion anymore, there are a lot of ignorant close minded religious/godly sentiments in this biitch. If you haven't taken any biology, or evolution courses. And you are a uni student i suggest you take a 101.

This will probably be my final rant. Im truly annoyed with some of the comments that continue to say "there could be a god..." "There is a god".

To say you believe in god and you know there is a god etc. Is absolutely absurd. It shows your lack of ability to rationalize, and think critically.

Religion and their God(s) created an easy way for individuals to avoid doing any thinking for themselves. Why ask questions, why look for answers, just say that god did/will do it and fuk off with sciences. This is why you cannot believe in god(s) you are doing yourself an injustice.

The Scientific Method allows you to form a question or hypothesis, AND TEST IT. After the results you choose to accept it, or falsify based on your observations from the tests. If you have a hypothesis like "Did god create the world we live in, along with its inhabitants." How can you test this? You simply cannot, therefor WHY WASTE YOUR FUKING TIME believing something you cannot test, or observe for yourself? ITS STUPID, ITS FUKING DUMB, YOUR WASTING YOUR BRAIN CELLS.

If we all stupid fuking religious god thrusting morons... Science wouldn't exist, we wouldn't have any answers to the tough questions. We would still think that the earth is the center of the solar system. And i shiit you not n*ggas in ancient times believed "God" placed us in the center. WRONG WRONG, FUKING MOTHER FUKING WRONG. Religion and god is all bullshiit, it limits free thinking, an inhibits the human brain from thinking critically.

Do you know how easy it is to look at the stars and say... I wonder where stars come from? God made em. Fuking hell man.
Now on to evolution...

YOU CAN TEST EVOLUTION, YOU CAN WITNESS EVOLUTION. There are many ways to show evolution is obviously on the right track to figuring out this thing called LIFE.
We have physical evidence, fossil records... We can test these, there are many many method you can test to find the Age of fossil... With genetic testing we have managed to go even further. Anatomy again, Another fuking test. This is hard work testing, but its rewarding you know why... Because you find the fuking truth. You test test test, falsify and accept.

NO ONE, can test if "God" created all you see. But we can test evolutionary theories. And we have accepted it. By we the scientific community, because there is evidence, you can observe it with your fuking eyes.

If you pray to god(s) and say god(s) created "insert object, thing" what ever. You are wasting your time on this earth. The human race does not need you, we need people we are going to question, test, and help us evolve technologically. So we can improve life, because we only have 5 billion years left before the sun blows up.<NOT JOKING. So lets cut the bullshiit, and stop playing around with fairy tails and mystical stories. Lets get real, with facts, and intellectual notions, things we can test.

Stop following a religion, be your own person, dont let a book/deity/being what ever, control your life. THINK MAN, FUKING THINK. USE YOUR BRAIN. Sit down one day, write down 10 questions about anything. Google it... See how many list god in their sources.
u went in!
 5 years ago '10        #75
phillyfirst215 
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 Andrefrbk said:
Well the bible said the earth was what? 6k years old? So god created all this in 6k years?

Evolution is a very very slow process, that takes MILLIONS of years. Species branching constantly to form different species. Humans are the same way, the bible did not mention any of our "Homo" ancestors from millions of years ago. How can god create man, and forget to mention their ancestors? Its impossible to believe evolution, god, and creationism. They conflict far too much.

Also, its unusual that religious text fails to mention the dinosaurs, and their extinction. Id imagine if god created man, he also created dinosaurs, yet some how prophets etc. never mentioned it.

There is no mention of the earliest form of life that would eventually become us.

The reason why living things exist on this earth is because billions of years ago a single cell organism was formed, the conditions were just right. Providing all the necessary elements for the components of life. Carbon, oxygen, hydrogen, nitrogen, phosphorous, and the many many others.

Simply put there is absolutely no WAY the bible can be factual. If you think the bible is factual then i feel very sorry for you and others my friend.

parting large bodies of water with their hands, healing people with touch, creating everything you see in 7 days? Really though? 4-5 billion years of evolution, created by a god in 7 days. Oh wow that's impressive. Shiit goes against proven laws of physics, and medical science. Adam and eve? REALLY REAAAAALY!? Absolutely no evidence of this.

Let there be light... Where are the dinosaurs that ruled the earth for a billion years? It would be helpful if god's prophets told us how they became extinct. So we can confirm or reject the big bang theory. That a meteor wiped them out.

To those religious people out there, plz do the world a favor drop it. Create your own guide lines on how you want to live your life, your own morals and standards. Dont let some book with tons of crap turn you into a ignorant fool.


the post you're replying to didn't mention the bible. You can believe in a higher power and not necessarily a religion.
 5 years ago '05        #76
Andrefrbk 1067 heat pts1067 OP
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 phillyfirst215 said:
the post you're replying to didn't mention the bible. You can believe in a higher power and not necessarily a religion.
Im fuking done...

I cant take it anymore. n*ggas in here have absolutely no humanity. We are by far the most unique animals in the whole kingdom. We have the ability to think, experiment, and reason.

Then we have motherfukas who waste their time talking about higher powers, and all that other fukery.

THINGS WE CANNOT TEST...

Why do people insist on arguing their beliefs in the higher power/god's. WHY!? Its such a pointless notion to dwell on, or even argue about. I say this because it offers nothing to help humanity. Why believe in something that isnt tangible or can be investigated and proven.
Do you understand what im saying?

Learning about life, how it was created, how it evolved is 20x more valuable to invest your brain power into. Than sitting there trying to say god and higher power's created everything. Religion/god has done absolutely nothing to advance the human race.

Throughout history religion divided us, kept us from thinking freely, and answering tough questions using experiments. Proving all the religious ideals false, time and time again. The earth is flat, the earth is the center, the earth and its inhabitant came to be in 7 days... So called prophets, telling partially instinctive human beings how to live, and governing their lives. Because a god/higher power is looking down upon them, in the heavens, clouds, inside of a rotton azzhole what ever.

YO PEOPLE GROW UP, EDUCATE YOURSELVES, HELP US SUSTAIN THE HUMAN RACE, SO WE CAN SEE THE UNIVERSE... Like i said we got 5 billion years left on this biitch, its been calculated that the sun will grow and engulf the earth/or blow up from its size. Slowly religion is phasing out, every century people are getting with the program. Im some what confident that by 2100 humans will stop believing in shiit they cant prove, and spend their lives problem solving, discover things, and thinking for themselves instead of waiting for god to do it for them.


Last edited by Andrefrbk; 08-30-2012 at 08:36 PM..
 5 years ago '11        #77
Kadillac87 225 heat pts225
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 nightmare said:
i was, but kevante and that other dude already took the words out of my mouth
Neither one of you guys showed what scientific facts do not depend on a.ssumptions.
 5 years ago '06        #78
nightmare 429 heat pts429
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 Kadillac87 said:
Neither one of you guys showed what scientific facts do not depend on a.ssumptions.
i think u have a.ssumption and inference interchanged
 08-30-2012, 08:57 PM         #79
TheOrganicCell 
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All I believe is what Jesus has said, which is follow the ten commandments. God exists or else non of us would be able to understand or communicate with each other or have a soul for thought. With out a god, nothing would exist. It would be complete emptiness. Just like in FF7, Septhiroth said God is within all cells, connected as one divine entity. Thats my belief, but with following Jesus word.
 5 years ago '05        #80
Andrefrbk 1067 heat pts1067 OP
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Bare witness how fuking close minded, and ignorant people are to factual information.

[video - click to view]


Lazy thinkers will hold on to their primitive ideals, they are too lazy to investigate, observe evidence and form a conclusion. Just sit back and nod your head in church, take it all in. Creationist are blinded by their emotions, they are so weak minded. The long process of the becoming of living things, is too much to handle. They believe, i believe, we believe... Did you test, did you research, provide evidence? Is your hypothesis true? Of course it isnt. Lazy scum bums.


Last edited by Andrefrbk; 08-30-2012 at 09:33 PM..
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