Nas' Ghostwriting Controversy And How Social Media Has Ruined Journalism

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 5 years ago '05        #41
WCIB 111 heat pts111
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 Hovi Bryant said:
No, I didn't contradict myself.

I don't need proof to believe in anything. You never asked my reasoning as to why I believe her. That response my lead to a contradictory answer, but no. It wouldn't in my case. I'll save you the time.
So when proof is put before you, you still believe her?

Yeah. You contradicted yourself.
 5 years ago '10        #42
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 WCIB said:
So when proof is put before you, you still believe her?

Yeah. You contradicted yourself.
That is not concrete evidence. That can still be refuted.

You can't be serious.
 5 years ago '05        #43
WCIB 111 heat pts111
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 Hovi Bryant said:
That is not concrete evidence. That can still be refuted.

You can't be serious.
You're taking someone's word, who has no evidence, as truth. You say you believe her, yet you said that you can't say something like that without evidence REGARDLESS of what context you were using. So explain why won't you take the word of the people she spoke out of pocket on, Stic and Jay Electronica, as fact? Why would they lie? If it were me, I'd take my credit for contributing as Dream claimed I did to such a seminal work. Yet they VEHEMENTLY deny everything she's said... Why the fu*k would you believe a word she's said when, as Stic said in the link I provided, she was not even there? Ever.

She spoke out of pocket and nobody believes her except you.

But it's cool. You don't need proof to believe anything right?
 5 years ago '05        #44
WCIB 111 heat pts111
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You know what? Don't reply to my post. I've seen your posts and your opinion of Nas is CLEARLY slanted the other way... Plus your screenname. I thought I was having legit conversation, that's on me. Forget it.
 5 years ago '10        #45
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 WCIB said:
You're taking someone's word, who has no evidence, as truth. You say you believe her, yet you said that you can't say something like that without evidence REGARDLESS of what context you were using. So explain why won't you take the word of the people she spoke out of pocket on, Stic and Jay Electronica, as fact? Why would they lie? If it were me, I'd take my credit for contributing as Dream claimed I did to such a seminal work. Yet they VEHEMENTLY deny everything she's said... Why the fu*k would you believe a word she's said when, as Stic said in the link I provided, she was not even there? Ever.

She spoke out of pocket and nobody believes her except you.

But it's cool. You don't need proof to believe anything right?
When I said I believe Dream is telling the truth, it's based on numerous reasons. Even then, I know she could still be lying. A belief is not a fact, there's strong and weak beliefs based on what's out there to support it. It will always be theoretical without evidence.

With that said, you have no sense of critical thinking at all whatsoever. It's tragic.

In a nutshell, this entire thing is based on a he-said-she-said argument with NO proof at all. Your definition of the word proof is another man's statement which is no different from the original claim to begin with.

So, you can relax and stop trying to over think and making bs conclusions.
 5 years ago '05        #46
WCIB 111 heat pts111
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 Hovi Bryant said:
When I said I believe Dream is telling the truth, it's based on numerous reasons. Even then, I know she could still be lying. A belief is not a fact, there's strong and weak beliefs based on what's out there to support it. It will always be theoretical without evidence.

With that said, you have no sense of critical thinking at all whatsoever. It's tragic.

In a nutshell, this entire thing is based on a he-said-she-said argument with NO proof at all. Your definition of the word proof is another man's statement which is no different from the original claim to begin with.

So, you can relax and stop trying to over think and making bs conclusions.
Here's how I know I've been having a conversation with an idiot. The burden of proof lies with her! You're ignoring firsthand accounts of Stic who was directly involved with the project. She can say 2pac ghostwrote Untitled from the grave and we'd all call her an idiot, yet your response is there is 'no physical evidence she's lying'???

If the accuser makes a claim such as hers, then backs it up with nothing, while the people she accused all stick to the same story, WHICH SHE HERSELF CAN'T PROVE TO BE FALSE, nobody would even take her case in a court of law. She'd be a fu*king laughingstock. Just like you are. That's the last post I'll make towards you in this thread.
 08-17-2012, 02:18 PM         #47
Lo 546  OP
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 noverum said:
in·teg·ri·ty/inˈtegritē/
Noun:
The quality of being honest and having strong moral principles; moral uprightness.


So telling the public only what the industry wants them to hear so that you get greater access to juicier sources is your definition of journalistic integrity? As far as I'm concerned, that's the definition of corruption.

cor·rup·tion/kəˈrəpSHən/
Noun:
Dishonest or fraudulent conduct by those in power, typically involving bribery.
 5 years ago '09        #48
Ash10 21 heat pts21
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 WCIB said:
Here's how I know I've been having a conversation with an idiot. The burden of proof lies with her! You're ignoring firsthand accounts of Stic who was directly involved with the project. She can say 2pac ghostwrote Untitled from the grave and we'd all call her an idiot, yet your response is there is 'no physical evidence she's lying'???

If the accuser makes a claim such as hers, then backs it up with nothing, while the people she accused all stick to the same story, WHICH SHE HERSELF CAN'T PROVE TO BE FALSE, nobody would even take her case in a court of law. She'd be a fu*king laughingstock. Just like you are. That's the last post I'll make towards you in this thread.
I remember used going back and forth Hovi Bryant 2 years ago, n*gga hates Nas, I don't even bother with him because his a stubborn fool that's not open minded,
 5 years ago '10        #49
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 ash1990 said:
I remember used going back and forth Hovi Bryant 2 years ago, n*gga hates Nas, I don't even bother with him because his a stubborn fool that's not open minded,
I hate Nas? Care to share any evidence of that?
 5 years ago '04        #50
abstractq 5 heat pts
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 WCIB said:
Here's how I know I've been having a conversation with an idiot. The burden of proof lies with her! You're ignoring firsthand accounts of Stic who was directly involved with the project. She can say 2pac ghostwrote Untitled from the grave and we'd all call her an idiot, yet your response is there is 'no physical evidence she's lying'???

If the accuser makes a claim such as hers, then backs it up with nothing, while the people she accused all stick to the same story, WHICH SHE HERSELF CAN'T PROVE TO BE FALSE, nobody would even take her case in a court of law. She'd be a fu*king laughingstock. Just like you are. That's the last post I'll make towards you in this thread.

100% truth

the funny thing is, Hovi basically taking up a stance that unless Dream herself recants, he's gonna believe Nas had ghostwriters

Since everyone that was in the studio said it wasnt true, theres not much more to be done here. Not like Nas can provide a reference track to prove that it was him

Dream came out her face, she should have had somebody to back her up. If, not, i really dont see any reason to belive her unless youre just predisposed to be cynical or you always trust girls or some other illogical thing

Of course its witin the realm of feasibility that Stic, Jay are lying and nas really needed ghostwriting for the album. . .I wouldnt call it a likely outcome though
 5 years ago '10        #51
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 WCIB said:
Here's how I know I've been having a conversation with an idiot. The burden of proof lies with her! You're ignoring firsthand accounts of Stic who was directly involved with the project. She can say 2pac ghostwrote Untitled from the grave and we'd all call her an idiot, yet your response is there is 'no physical evidence she's lying'???

If the accuser makes a claim such as hers, then backs it up with nothing, while the people she accused all stick to the same story, WHICH SHE HERSELF CAN'T PROVE TO BE FALSE, nobody would even take her case in a court of law. She'd be a fu*king laughingstock. Just like you are. That's the last post I'll make towards you in this thread.
I'm not ignoring anything. Just because Stic was directly involved with the project does not disprove the original claim.

There's questions that you refuse to acknowledge or just haven't objectively considered.

If someone is being accused as a ghostwriter, what advantages does that person have by admitting it?

Are there any well known ghostwriters who openly admit who they have written songs or composed reference tracks for?

If not, then why is that the case?


I believe Stic has a reputation to protect, to show that anything in the form of ghostwriting or other matters that are confidential, he will not disclose. I think most of us believe that having anyone write your material is frowned upon in Hip-Hop, so this is understandable.

So, once again... I'm not ignoring what Stic is saying. Honestly, I would expect this from him.

If he really wanted to dead all of this on the spot, or if he had the power to... he would drop video footage. If he doesn't have it, then fine. The whole thing goes unresolved.

Also, just because everyone (which is like who? 3 people?) have similar stories, does not mean that they could all be lying. History has proven this. This isn't something that's completely unique here.

I see what you're trying to say with the whole "if she said this"... angle..but the fact of the matter is...she didn't. Her reputation in this industry goes as far back as Nas, Stic.man, Jay-Z, longer than Electronica... and so on. She's just as credible as a source, as Nas is when it comes to being a top 5 lyricist of all time.
 5 years ago '05        #52
WCIB 111 heat pts111
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 abstractq said:
100% truth

the funny thing is, Hovi basically taking up a stance that unless Dream herself recants, he's gonna believe Nas had ghostwriters

Since everyone that was in the studio said it wasnt true, theres not much more to be done here. Not like Nas can provide a reference track to prove that it was him

Dream came out her face, she should have had somebody to back her up. If, not, i really dont see any reason to belive her unless youre just predisposed to be cynical or you always trust girls or some other illogical thing

Of course its witin the realm of feasibility that Stic, Jay are lying and nas really needed ghostwriting for the album. . .I wouldnt call it a likely outcome though
Real talk. I would NEVER say that nothing is possible. I simply won't allow this woman to use her credibility (or lack thereof in this case) to just skate by and call people by name to substantiate a lie? Or at least a lie that the people she named have called it. I remember a thread a few weeks ago where Nas wanted Jay Electronica to produce the entire 'Untitled' album. So with those FACTS, I'll draw this conclusion: why let someone ghostwrite an entire album, as Dream claimed, yet somehow Jay Electronica didn't produce the album? That's interesting. He didn't produce it, only one track according to the liner notes, yet he stuck around to ghostwrite it? Yeah. Great job by ol' credible Dream Hampton.
 5 years ago '10        #53
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 abstractq said:
100% truth

the funny thing is, Hovi basically taking up a stance that unless Dream herself recants, he's gonna believe Nas had ghostwriters

Since everyone that was in the studio said it wasnt true, theres not much more to be done here. Not like Nas can provide a reference track to prove that it was him

Dream came out her face, she should have had somebody to back her up. If, not, i really dont see any reason to belive her unless youre just predisposed to be cynical or you always trust girls or some other illogical thing

Of course its witin the realm of feasibility that Stic, Jay are lying and nas really needed ghostwriting for the album. . .I wouldnt call it a likely outcome though

Majority opinion does not replace factual evidence (which there is none of on either side). Mass cover up is always a possibility. Given the fact that Nas is considered to be the greatest lyricist ever, then it definitively seems worth it. There's a principle to protect that's greater than what Nas is. The very integrity of Hip-Hop itself would be compromised if Dream was proven to be correct.
 5 years ago '09        #54
Ash10 21 heat pts21
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 Hovi Bryant said:
I hate Nas? Care to share any evidence of that?
You know what I'm talking about, E.G THE IRS NAS THREAD,
btw I've noticed you cosign anything that says negatives things about nas
 5 years ago '10        #55
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 ash1990 said:
You know what I'm talking about, E.G THE IRS NAS THREAD,
btw I've noticed you cosign anything that says negatives things about nas
I co-sign anything that's negative about Nas?
 5 years ago '04        #56
abstractq 5 heat pts
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 Hovi Bryant said:
Majority opinion does not replace factual evidence (which there is none of on either side). Mass cover up is always a possibility. Given the fact that Nas is considered to be the greatest lyricist ever, then it definitively seems worth it. There's a principle to protect that's greater than what Nas is. The very integrity of Hip-Hop itself would be compromised if Dream was proven to be correct.

lol

The fact is that the only people that were there as eyewitnesses deny that they ghostwrote for Nas.

If you dont accept this, then in your mind there is no possibility for factual evidence on Nas side. . .you realize this right?

My basic point though is that you basically defaulting to the idea that Nas needed ghostwriters, cause Dream hasnt supported or proved anything. I dont know of any figure that has backed her up as of yet. If Dream is a legend like that, you'd think someone would vouch for her story. She cant possibly be the only person on the planet that heard these reference tracks that is willing to speak on it. . .

And if it turns out that reference tracks leak and Dream is correct, its not as big a deal as you making it. . .Untitled was that great lyrically

Now if it turns out that Mega wrote illmatic. . .
 5 years ago '09        #57
Ash10 21 heat pts21
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 Hovi Bryant said:
I co-sign anything that's negative about Nas?


Yes, Your posts on nas threads says it all, do us all a favor let it out why you hate Nas
 5 years ago '10        #58
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 abstractq said:
lol

The fact is that the only people that were there as eyewitnesses deny that they ghostwrote for Nas.

If you dont accept this, then in your mind there is no possibility for factual evidence on Nas side. . .you realize this right?

My basic point though is that you basically defaulting to the idea that Nas needed ghostwriters, cause Dream hasnt supported or proved anything. I dont know of any figure that has backed her up as of yet. If Dream is a legend like that, you'd think someone would vouch for her story. She cant possibly be the only person on the planet that heard these reference tracks that is willing to speak on it. . .

And if it turns out that reference tracks leak and Dream is correct, its not as big a deal as you making it. . .Untitled was that great lyrically

Now if it turns out that Mega wrote illmatic. . .
If I don't accept this...?

I'm defaulting to what now?

I don't think I have ever insulated or implied that Nas needs ghostwriters. I believe the thought of Nas having ghostwriters is insane. But, here we are with a longstanding, acclaimed writer in Hip-Hop with a claim that has no ties to anything to further her career at all...

It's more of a reach to go this far to make such a defense without sounding any more foolish than what you're saying right now.
 5 years ago '10        #59
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 ash1990 said:
Yes, Your posts on nas threads says it all, do us all a favor let it out why you hate Nas
I think you'd be a horrible lawyer. Even worse with jury duty.
 5 years ago '09        #60
Ash10 21 heat pts21
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I'm not trying to be a lawyer, your mad that Nas fu*ked your mother


Last edited by Ash10; 08-17-2012 at 03:35 PM..
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