Mar 20 - National Debt has increased more under Obama than under Bush

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 6 years ago '06        #141
KFrizzle 296 heat pts296
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 minimafia_aj said:
lol I KNEW you where gonna bring that up. she wasn't asking for free birth control. they want it covered under healthcare plans cause it has other uses other than contraception.
Then WTF is the issue?
No one is taking Birth Control away. No one is putting any restrictions on BC.
She complained about a 50$ co-pay? If you can't afford that use fu*king condems
 03-20-2012, 09:18 PM         #142
Ahura  OP
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 tupacnasfan said:
2000 the ecomony went into a deficit.

Clinton had the tech boom.
And he had the tech bust as he was leaving the office. Also the housing mess was created under Clinton watch. Frank and Dodd's baby that grew up and ate the country due to unregulated subprime loans to anyone who can blink.
 03-20-2012, 09:21 PM         #143
Ahura  OP
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 tupacnasfan said:
We should just let them fail.
No more bailouts for the wealthy.
This is capitalism. What our country has become is a corporatism.
 6 years ago '06        #144
KFrizzle 296 heat pts296
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Also bro, its highly unconstitutional.
No one in the Government can tell a company what they must give to there customers. Come on now

And sandra fluck is a 'reproductive rights activist', If she was that consired about BC, she should have picked a different school to go too. Maybe one that carries it since is such a big issue to her, or maybe a cheaper school so she could afford it. But i pay for my Girl's BC, you don't hear me complaining.
 6 years ago '06        #145
KFrizzle 296 heat pts296
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 Ahura said:
This is capitalism. What our country has become is a corporatism.
I would say
'Crony Capitalism'
Definition
:A description of capitalist society as being based on the close relationships between businessmen and the state. Instead of success being determined by a free market and the rule of law, the success of a business is dependent on the favoritism that is shown to it by the ruling government in the form of tax breaks, government grants and other incentives.

Way to much government favoring, green energy isn't even profitable and gets way way to much grants/funding! The government shouldn't pick the winner's and loser's, We the People shall


Last edited by KFrizzle; 03-20-2012 at 09:27 PM..
 6 years ago '07        #146
Ham Rove 3510 heat pts3510
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 KFrizzle said:
Then WTF is the issue?
No one is taking Birth Control away. No one is putting any restrictions on BC.
She complained about a 50$ co-pay? If you can't afford that use fu*king condems
apparently you don't know Birth Control has tons of other medical uses other than preventing pregnancy. So how is using condoms gonna prevent ovarian cysts?
 KFrizzle said:
Also bro, its highly unconstitutional.
No one in the Government can tell a company what they must give to there customers. Come on now

And sandra fluck is a 'reproductive rights activist', If she was that consired about BC, she should have picked a different school to go too. Maybe one that carries it since is such a big issue to her, or maybe a cheaper school so she could afford it. But i pay for my Girl's BC, you don't hear me complaining.
No one is telling these institutions what they can sell to their customers what the fu*k are you talking about? Its about the employees not the customers. Her testimony wasn't about how she can't afford it, it was about how lots of women can't and it should be covered under their employers health benefits. And if shes an activist why would she go to a school that covers it? If shes trying to raise awareness about the issue, her going to a school that covers it would do nothing.

The only reason it became such a huge issue is because that idiot Issa wouldn't allow her to speak and then that other idiot Rush insulted her for 3 days.
 6 years ago '06        #147
KFrizzle 296 heat pts296
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 minimafia_aj said:
apparently you don't know Birth Control has tons of other medical uses other than preventing pregnancy. So how is using condoms gonna prevent ovarian cysts?


No one is telling these institutions what they can sell to their customers what the fu*k are you talking about? Its about the employees not the customers. Her testimony wasn't about how she can't afford it, it was about how lots of women can't and it should be covered under their employers health benefits. And if shes an activist why would she go to a school that covers it? If shes trying to raise awareness about the issue, her going to a school that covers it would do nothing.

Ya i think everyone knows that, ha

Ya bro but the school don't cover it cause they don't religiously believe in it.
and that's the whole issue, is that the democrats want all insurance to cover it, even if the company/school/etc. doesn't believe in it. We can't have the government being that controlling.
The government doesn't have that power to tell companies to do so.


Peace out, continue this tommorrow fella
 6 years ago '06        #148
Down-N-H-Town 6 heat pts
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 STATlanta2006 said:
not true! not trying to make an excuse for obama cause the debt obviously needs to be addressed but obama's spending (even bush's during the last year) was somewhat necessary to prevent the recession from becoming a depression. bush on the other hand was given a surplus from clinton and he got us into massive debts cause we started 2 wars and cut taxes at the same time. obama was doing the same thing, but he ended the iraq war, will end afghanistan next year (if relected), and he's been trying to get tax rates up for the wealthy to pay off some of the national debt.

Thank you. I didn't wanna have to write it.
 6 years ago '07        #149
ttime236 38 heat pts38
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:

The economy hasn't recovered man. Most of the money he's spent has gone to special interests just like Bush and all those before him.

Oh and how much you think Iran / Syria are gonna cost
Care to explain the stock market recovery? Reaching high points in the last couple weeks and unemployment is way down. Noones perfect and that especially goes for a political figure, but Ill take Obamas accomplishment over Bush's accomplishments

edit:After reading through this thread, some of yall are sooo misinformed about the most basic concepts. Internet/Google making everybody an expert on matters these days, free information is a gift and curse


Last edited by ttime236; 03-20-2012 at 10:42 PM..
 03-20-2012, 10:34 PM         #150
TUNES707  OP
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dont matter who you voted for.. America is a mess... placing blame on a single person wont get sh*t done...

how bout we stop buying sh*t we cant afford
 6 years ago '05        #151
DaViLLe726 3 heat pts
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 Hovi Bryant said:
Look, you inbred degenerate...

I'm not going to entertain the matter of Bin Laden any further. Some of you fu*ks still believe Saddam is alive and kicking, since his picture released was edited.

I'm pretty sure the government could release DNA and photos and you still won't buy it. Just like some of you fu*ks believe we never walked on the Moon. So, give it up already. If the most bitter Republicans known to man can give Obama praise, you should have the decency to leave the subject alone if you can't even do that much.



And for everything else you said, I really don't give a sh*t. I'll read it tomorrow if enough retards decide to quote you.
The exact number of nuclear weapons in each country's possession is a closely held national secret. Despite this limitation, however, publicly available information and occasional leaks make it possible to make best estimates about the size and composition of the national nuclear weapon stockpiles.

thats a quote from the website you gave
So going on the information you are giving which basically says no one knows.

Way to ether yourself in your own post tho. That was awesome.

at you thinking republicans and dems are different. when you realize there is no diff YOU can come back and sit at the table.
 03-20-2012, 11:03 PM         #152
Ahura  OP
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 ttime236 said:
Care to explain the stock market recovery? Reaching high points in the last couple weeks and unemployment is way down. Noones perfect and that especially goes for a political figure, but Ill take Obamas accomplishment over Bush's accomplishments

edit:After reading through this thread, some of yall are sooo misinformed about the most basic concepts. Internet/Google making everybody an expert on matters these days, free information is a gift and curse

The market have recovered and the stockholders are doing well, but the stockmarket recovery really reflect the well being of American public? For the wealthy, rich, well off, to comfortable the market has been very rewarding to them but what about the ones who are still jobless and the under employed people?

The January job count was up but I believe they are now down again. What is deceptive about the jobless numbers is that it only count the ones who are taking the benefits. The ones who have already gone through the process are off the system and off the radar. They are not being counted so basically if you count those and the new applicants the numbers are far higher. Then you have large number of people who are underemployed and they will never get back to their former pay scale.

With the homeownership, which have always been the major part of people's wealth, people are taking a huge lost. Many are underwater. Many have lost their homes after years of putting money into it. Now they are homeless, broke, and have bad credit. With the major part of people wealth taking a big hit and continue to get hit, for the ordinary Joes who don't have stockmarket portfolios the economy have not improved. Matter of fact, each year their value of the home goes down, thats more money they are losing. With cost of living going up and wages staying stagnant, people are actually getting poorer. The economy really hasn't improved at all.

I believe the market have done great things for those who are playing in the market. The ones who don't have to worry about trying to make the utility, mortgage, rent, car, insurance bills for that month, the economy is great. The market is great.
 6 years ago '06        #153
revolution03 
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Thanks Obama, but you will still blame Bush for this situation
 6 years ago '12        #154
noverum 
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 KFrizzle said:
I would say
'Crony Capitalism'
Definition
:A description of capitalist society as being based on the close relationships between businessmen and the state. Instead of success being determined by a free market and the rule of law, the success of a business is dependent on the favoritism that is shown to it by the ruling government in the form of tax breaks, government grants and other incentives.

Way to much government favoring, green energy isn't even profitable and gets way way to much grants/funding! The government shouldn't pick the winner's and loser's, We the People shall
The problem with that definition is that it suggests the dominant source of corruptive influence to be governmental; whereas corporatism implies a constantly varying power dynamic between corporate and government interests.

Definition of CORPORATISM

- a political and economic system in which planning and policy are controlled by large groups such as businesses, trade unions, and central government



Corporate interests aren't business-exclusive. The government is influenced by non-democratic organisations of any kind; social activist, business, military etc.

Definition of CORPORATION

- an a.ssociation of employers and employees in a basic industry or of members of a profession organized as an organ of political representation in a corporative state



The nature of corporatism is that human beings aren't seen as individuals but as collective entities determined by common characteristics, whether they be vested interest, identities or demographics.
Democracy becomes largely irrelevant, because government policy is dictated by lobbying forces that garner influence through promises of financial or public promotion, or through threats of dissension. Leaders of government yield because they depend on the appeasement of those vested interests to retain control over the population. There are many problems with such a scenario (not least an increase in government size and power) because individual liberty ends up being held hostage by large organisations (ie corporations). In terms of the economic landscape you end up with something like crony capitalism.

The end result is that government will grow while dancing to music being played by hidden musicians until it's too fat to dance any longer; at which point civilization collapses.
 6 years ago '10        #155
Hovi Bryant 676 heat pts676
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 DaViLLe726 said:
The exact number of nuclear weapons in each country's possession is a closely held national secret. Despite this limitation, however, publicly available information and occasional leaks make it possible to make best estimates about the size and composition of the national nuclear weapon stockpiles.

thats a quote from the website you gave
So going on the information you are giving which basically says no one knows.

Way to ether yourself in your own post tho. That was awesome.

at you thinking republicans and dems are different. when you realize there is no diff YOU can come back and sit at the table.

That quote does not disprove my claim. It's documented with the plausibility of being inaccurate, more so for Russia than us. The U.S. wants to be transparent about nukes.

Russia has more nukes. It's probably been like that since the Cold War. Get over it.
 6 years ago '10        #156
AmazinJay 2 heat pts
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All of you are misinformed. Lets just replace Bush and Obama with two other presidents with the same government system in tact. Bet we stil be in the same situation we are in now regardless of their policies.4 years is not enough time to create systemic breakdowns in the overall economy. It takes more than that.
 6 years ago '04        #157
JBeezy 1 heat pts
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 Frank Hampton said:
It's called a conflict, and it's not illegal

It's one of the powers guaranteed to the commander in chief of the United States aka The president

Just like Vietnam and Korean "wars" were Conflicts.

I'm not saying I agree with it but just because the President sends out troops somewhere it doesn't make it a war
The Commander in Chief DOES NOT have the authority to go on the offensive and attack other nations. The CnC directs the military once Congress declares war. Call it war, or a conflict all you want, in an attempt to water down what happened. But the reality is our military k!lled foreigners in an offensive attack that was not authorized by Congress, nor was it in defense of our homeland.

In a letter to Thomas Jefferson, James Madison wrote;
"The constitution supposes, what the History of all Governments demonstrates, that the Executive is the branch of power most interested in war, and most prone to it. It has accordingly with studied care vested the question of war in the Legislature.”

George Washington was obviously in agreement;
“The Constitution vests the power of declaring war with Congress. Therefore no offensive expedition of importance can be undertaken until after they have deliberated upon the subject, and authorized such a measure.”
 6 years ago '12        #158
noverum 
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 Frank Hampton said:
Just like Vietnam and Korean "wars" were Conflicts.
What a hideous perversion of logic.

Why don't we just throw out the constitution altogether. After all, just like the Vietnam "war" wasn't a violation of Article One, Section 8 because it was a really just a "conflict"; taping someone's mouth shut isn't a violation of the first amendment, it's a hate-speech "deterrent".
 6 years ago '04        #159
JBeezy 1 heat pts
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 dlettern said:
Didn't Bush inherit a surplus? Then his bad judgements lead to 9/11, The war in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the relaxed wall street laws that lead to the housing mess which subsequently lead to our recession?.....Oh yeah, he left right after that. Don't believe the hype
Clinton raided Social Security and replaced the money with IOUs. It was also under Clinton that banks were pressured to give loans to people without the means to make the payments. The Fed injected the market with billions of dollars that lead to moral hazard and malinvestment. Neither the Fed, nor Freddie and Fannie are George Bush creations. They've been around for while. Bush didn't help, but the ball was rolling LONG before he took office.

 cedar49 said:
Come on ... really Bush caused our money to be worth less than before so we honestly spend more $ in #s... also Obama had to bail out the entire banking system and auto sector ... u negativity stans are ridiculous ....
The dollar has been losing value (roughly 95%) since 1913. Blame the Fed for the dollar's devaluation.

 minimafia_aj said:
I'm not a democrat, so its not my "party" and I didn't blame bush for Gas prices. Like I've said 100's of times I know its controlled on a global market. not much a president can do short term. He didn't campaign on not raising the debt ceiling, he voted against it before but he didn't campaign for it. And I'm on Obamas nuts cause I use fact over nonsense? Yeah ok.


 Hovi Bryant said:
You are truly an idiot of massive proportions. Words cannot describe how lost you are.

The United States is no longer in a recession. It is over. The economy has recovered. If you do not want to accept that, fine. Just don't try to preach that crap. Lean the basics of economics and then tell me the same bullsh*t.

The only folks willing to even entertain half of the sh*t you're saying are those that lined up to endorse Sarah Pailin.

You weird fu*ks scour the Internet for some of the most janky, untrusted, desolate sites around and want us to buy the sh*t they're saying? It's always the stuff you want to hear. No sense of being objective at all in the slightest.

The national debt this country owns is a joke. It was amassed by republicans more than 30 years ago. They're trying to force the government to shrink by creating massive debt through tax breaks and deregulation of financial institutes. Starving the beast is what they call it.

Obama has kick started the private sector. He saved the auto industry. President Obama has brought back regulations to financial and credit institutions. He deserves credit for bringing the economy out of a recession in the face of Republicans that wanted us back in it.

Until you can comprehend the facts, then you're just wasting time.
1. The basis of economics is savings and production, not mass government spending and debt. Try reading a book sometime. Here's a start:

[pic - click to view]


2. If you think Republicans alone have accrued this debt then you're blind
3. The auto industry didn't need to be saved. It was AMERICAN companies that were failing after decades of bad decision making. The auto industry would be just fine if GM wasn't given taxpayer money.

 Ahura said:
The market have recovered and the stockholders are doing well, but the stockmarket recovery really reflect the well being of American public? For the wealthy, rich, well off, to comfortable the market has been very rewarding to them but what about the ones who are still jobless and the under employed people?

The January job count was up but I believe they are now down again. What is deceptive about the jobless numbers is that it only count the ones who are taking the benefits. The ones who have already gone through the process are off the system and off the radar. They are not being counted so basically if you count those and the new applicants the numbers are far higher. Then you have large number of people who are underemployed and they will never get back to their former pay scale.

With the homeownership, which have always been the major part of people's wealth, people are taking a huge lost. Many are underwater. Many have lost their homes after years of putting money into it. Now they are homeless, broke, and have bad credit. With the major part of people wealth taking a big hit and continue to get hit, for the ordinary Joes who don't have stockmarket portfolios the economy have not improved. Matter of fact, each year their value of the home goes down, thats more money they are losing. With cost of living going up and wages staying stagnant, people are actually getting poorer. The economy really hasn't improved at all.

I believe the market have done great things for those who are playing in the market. The ones who don't have to worry about trying to make the utility, mortgage, rent, car, insurance bills for that month, the economy is great. The market is great.
Thank you. As Peter Schiff would say..."You guys have to start looking at the real numbers"...

The "official" government statistics are a joke. Slanted numbers fed to idiots as red meat to keep this Left Vs. Right game going.
 6 years ago '04        #160
iLLwiLLis 
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Dude that tried to "debate" with me earlier pulled the BX move by immediately dismissing every article or story without reading it bc he classified it as "conservative talking points". In fact, one of the articles is from a liberal site (and the law it refers to was not conjured up by a party...it actually happened), but dude was too stupid to even realize that. Better yet, I'm called a sheep for being skeptical of our government and its motives (ahh the irony) by someone who can't even make a coherent point about anything. Ignore the Goldman Sachs cabinet, ignore your civil liberties slowly evaporating without resistance... I really don't give a fu*k if you're stupid enough to be so short-sighted bc you think "it dont affect a n*gga's day to day". The fact is, if you ride this clown's d!ck, and you honestly believe that he is somehow different or better than the as*hole before him, you're part of the problem. The reality is these corporate fu*king shills hope you either believe they're acting in your interest or become so disillusioned that you just give up. Hey everybody, look at the "recovered" economy while we set up domestic spying that DWARFS the Patriot Act. Unemployment is slightly down, so don't you worry about the enormous database being built in Utah AS WE SPEAK meant to log all your calls, texts, and emails. And what will you say when it all crumbles down again, and the same sh*theads are asking for bailouts again (that will be given to them bc they are inextricably tied into every branch of our government)? I know a lot of people on here will say it was all Bush and Barry would never do anything to fu*k us over. Moral of the story: Diss Obama on a hip hop site (even if you have equally negative feelings towards Bush) and feel the wrath of the uninformed.
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