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 5 years ago '05        #81
PussyFiend 
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So we really got LeBrons biggest stans talking about ESPN brainwashing people


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TEBOW AND LEBRICK = ESPN MOST TALKED ABOUT ATHLETES


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 5 years ago '06        #82
philly337 19 heat pts19 OP
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 pus*yFiend said:
So we really got LeBrons biggest stans talking about ESPN brainwashing people


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TEBOW AND LEBRICK = ESPN MOST TALKED ABOUT ATHLETES


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Men lie women lie...numbers don't. I like how you skipped the post

Here's a video for you


[video - click to view]

 5 years ago '12        #83
DoMieD 5 heat pts
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 Kasssssst said:
I want to point one thing out...

outside of

Goldie Lock/Bynum/Gasol/Fisher

who the hell else does he have to pass to?

Can't no one on this team make fu*king shots
Damn.. Sounds like the story of LBJ's career.. And he ain't even have anything close to those 4 options until last year and even then he still only had 3.
 5 years ago '06        #84
philly337 19 heat pts19 OP
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And here's an article.....lebrons team in clutch + 126 (winning them games) kobes team in clutch -13 (losing them games)

Closer.

Assassin.

Cold-blooded k!ller.

Over the past few seasons, these labels have become synonymous with Kobe Bryant, the NBA's preeminent king of clutch. Time and time again, we have witnessed Bryant's heroics at the end of games. The Lakers star had a league-leading six game winners in the final 10 seconds of games in 2009-10, with his flair for the dramatic seemingly becoming a weekly fixture.

Bryant is, by all accounts, the player you want to have the ball when the game is on the line.

So why do the numbers say otherwise? Or, more to the point, why do they suggest LeBron James, not Bryant, has performed better in the clutch recently?

The hard data

To be clear, no two people will have identical opinions of when a basketball game enters the proverbial game-on-the-line territory. But if we stick to the generally accepted criteria of clutch -- thanks to the go-to crunch-time source 82games.com -- we draw the line at less than 5 minutes left in the fourth quarter or overtime, with the game within five points. Using those thresholds, we see some eye-catching facts: Despite Bryant's six game winners last season, James bested him in just about every statistical category down the stretch in clutch situations.

Here are the facts: James has posted a mind-boggling 47.2 Player Efficiency Rating while averaging 48.1 points on 45 percent shooting, 10.9 rebounds and 5.6 a.ssists per 40 minutes in the clutch over the past two seasons. Bryant? He checks in at a 37.6 PER, with an average of 44.5 points on 43 percent shooting, 4.3 rebounds and 4.3 a.ssists. Statistically, James outperformed Bryant on the defensive end as well, averaging 1.8 blocks and 2.1 steals. Kobe, on the other hand, has averaged 1.6 steals with no blocks in crunch time.

That's just an absurd level of production from both players, but James clearly has the upper hand. (And career-wise, James has the edge as well).

The team context

So the question then becomes: Is James selfishly piling up stats at the expense of his team's success?

It appears to be the opposite.

James' teams have outscored opponents by 126 points in his 228 minutes of clutch play, debunking the theory that James is merely a compiler of empty stats; his individual play has coincided with winning basketball. Bryant is another story. Even with far superior teammates than James' former Cavs crew, Bryant has posted a minus-13 plus-minus in his 224 minutes of clutch situations. That is to say, the Lakers have, quite shockingly, been a losing team with Bryant on the floor down the stretch over the past two seasons.

This is a critical point. Boiling down clutch performance to six last-second shots is an extremely narrow view of the game. The circumstance happens so rarely that it is virtually a trivial exercise in randomness. To put it in perspective, Bryant and James have played a combined 7,871 minutes over the past two regular seasons, and only 17 of those minutes were played when their respective teams needed a "big shot" (tied or trailing by no more than three points with the game clock at less than 24 seconds). That's 0.02 percent of the time.

These numbers reveal James' teams haven't needed last-second heroics because his monstrous late-game play pushes the close game out of reach, rendering a game-winning shot unnecessary. Houston Rockets general manager Daryl Morey once said, "Good teams don't win close games -- they avoid them." And the player who personifies that ethos is James.

The highlight reel conundrum

We can direct some of the blame to the construct of the highlight reel. As a game's CliffsNotes, highlight reels capture the awe-inspiring plays and dramatic game-changing events in snapshots. They give us the game-winning shot, but the rest gets tossed to the cutting-room floor. And the truth is, we don't get to see all the times a player fails in critical moments; we see only the ones when he succeeds.

Highlight reels, by design, help facilitate our inherent confirmation bias -- a fallacy of the human mind that causes us to remember what confirms our preconceived notions and throw out the contradictory evidence. Bryant holds the reputation as the game's most clutch player, and who are we to disagree when we see Bryant with a game winner seemingly every fifth day? No one has the time or the interest to watch all 96 of Bryant's missed field goal attempts in clutch situations since 2008-09. But those happened, and we need to account for them.

Also, there's a certain flair to Bryant's typical game winners that lends itself to immortality. We watch in anticipation as the ball leaves Bryant's fingertips on a contested perimeter jumper, which is the toughest shot in the game. But the degree of difficulty of the shot works both ways. When he hits the back-breaking shot, it is heroic. But when he misses, it is understandable. All of James' seven makes have come within 8 feet, while all nine of Bryant's makes have come outside 12 feet (he missed his only attempt inside 12 feet, a layup).

So as scorers, James and Bryant have different styles, and this certainly has a dramatic effect on how we remember them as clutch players. Bryant's outside game provides better theater, whereas James' bruising attack leads to comparatively sleepy trips to the free throw line. But they provide the same means to an end.

Ultimately, Bryant and James are two all-time legends, and it seems silly to boil their greatness to a few seconds of play. While the debate between LeBron James and Kobe Bryant will never die, the clutch badge has always rested on Bryant's sleeve. Now we're seeing that it isn't quite that simple.

If you want a game-winning shot, you might choose Bryant. But that happens no more than a handful of times per season.

If you want a player to carry the team down the stretch in the fourth quarter, we find that James, not Bryant, boasts the winning track record in the clutch.


Last edited by philly337; 02-09-2012 at 10:05 PM..
 5 years ago '10        #85
MrTripleDouble 
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When you win championships you can get away with ALOT of sh*t. Even r*pe. Once LeBron wins a ring people won't sweat the f*cking guy but until then they gonna be nagging him like a narcissistic mother.


Last edited by MrTripleDouble; 02-09-2012 at 10:06 PM..
 5 years ago '06        #86
PG-13 126 heat pts126
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 SteveSS said:
Like Kobe going 7-24 in a Game 7?
Wasn't it 6-24?

 philly337 said:
I guess ill son you..you been asking for it all night

Gw shot % reg season

LeBron 34%
Kobe 27% (prob 25% now)

Gw shots in the playoffs

LeBron 5 for 11
Kobe 6 for 27

Overall in the playoffs

LeBron 28 ppg, 8.4 apg, 7 rpg, 46% fg%, 32% 3pt%
Kobe 25.4 ppg, 5.1 apg, 4.8 rpg, 45% fg%, 34% 3pt%

Final 5 minutes of play with game within 5 points (past 4 years)









And LeBron hasn't performed but neither has Kobe...in 4 of 7 finals appearances he has shot 42%, 40%, 38%, and 37%....not to mention shooting 6-24 in a game 7, getting blown out by 39 against the Celtics in the finals, and losing a 20 point lead at home in the finals....and don't get me started on getting swept by the mavs and losing by damn near 40 in the closeout game and losing the 3-1 lead to the suns....


Pops collar...stick to what espn tells you
 5 years ago '06        #87
philly337 19 heat pts19 OP
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 PG-13 said:
Wasn't it 6-24?



Oh I got more...remember back in 08 before all the hate? LeBron lead the league in 4th quarter scoring (this its almost ever year recently) and his team led the league in 4th quarter comebacks. And guess what? Kobe was still choking back then too

LeBron leads the league in average points scored in the fourth quarter, with the Cleveland Cavaliers being the best come-from-behind team in the league. Yes, there are a number of inappropriate jokes we could have made in the previous sentence – but we’re too classy for the gutter.

In today’s game against the Portland Trail Blazers for instance, the Cavs were constantly on the back-foot and looked to be in danger of dropping a game against a very good opponent.

Then the unthinkable happened. James got riled by a Portland fan and then got postal on his opponents, scoring 17 final quarter points, which was two more then the entire Blazer squad. The cherry on top: Hitting the game winning lay-up, whilst making it looking like a stroll through the park. Most impressive of all, Bron-Bron made Brandon Roy look second rate when he was locking him down in the fourth.

Generally speaking, Kobe Bryant of the Los Angeles Lakers is seen to be the most deadly player with the game on the line, but again, James put paid to that general belief when their teams met last weekend.

Want some hardcore facts to back up our questioning of Kobe’s lack of clutch-ness? During the Cavs 98-95 win, King James dropped 14 in the fourth, with six in the final minute-and-a-half. Not only that, he was going against Bryant, with the Bean looking like the deer in the headlights when the game was to be won. Oh, yeah, in contrast, Kobe missed six of his seven attempts in the quarter where legends are made.

The final play from the Lakers had Bryant handling the ball needing a three – he ended up passing it to Luke Walton, who gave it back to the Bean, and the shot was always going to be weak.

James spent the offseason improving his jumper, and it k!lled the Blazers in the fourth quarter today when he hit three consecutive 3-point baskets. Not only that, LeBron spends so much time going to the free-throw line, and was shaky last season down the stretch – now, he is money due to his offseason work.

Kobe might still be the most deadly a.ssassin in the league, but there is a new King of clutch.
 5 years ago '05        #88
PussyFiend 
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 philly337 said:
Men lie women lie...numbers don't. I like how you skipped the post

Here's a video for you

what post?

i agree Men lie woman lie ...numbers don't


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Kobe - 5


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LeBrick - 0


 5 years ago '06        #89
philly337 19 heat pts19 OP
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Going to sleep...I think I've handed out too much ether for the night
 5 years ago '06        #90
philly337 19 heat pts19 OP
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 pus*yFiend said:
what post?

i agree Men lie woman lie ...numbers don't


[pic - click to view]



Kobe - 5


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LeBrick - 0


the one that's been quoted 10 times showing LeBron is better when "the game is on the line"
 5 years ago '05        #91
PussyFiend 
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 philly337 said:
Going to sleep...I think I've handed out too much ether for the night


you do that.....take your L and go to sleep princess...

shouldn't you be cheering on your GS Warriors instead of riding another mans d!ck all day....on top of that he don't even play for your team....

damn that sh*t's sad....
 02-09-2012, 10:31 PM         #92
SeaJaiye 
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 SeaJaiye said:
i dont think his brain can handle all that ether.............will probably bring up 5 rings and post some old a.ss pic
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told you he'd ignore the facts and post old pics i got a pic for u


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and this was before the massacre when heat/lakers played this year
 5 years ago '10        #93
KrayzieCMB 83 heat pts83
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 Illuminati said:
i thought this thread was about bayless man
I can see how you arrived at that conclusion.
 5 years ago '05        #94
PussyFiend 
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 SeaJaiye said:
told you he'd ignore the facts and post old pics i got a pic for u


[pic - click to view]



and this was before the massacre when heat/lakers played this year
on a scale of 1-10 how much do you hate and envy the success and greatness of kobe and the lakers though ?

 02-09-2012, 10:34 PM         #95
SeaJaiye 
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 pus*yFiend said:
on a scale of 1-10 how much do you hate and envy the success and greatness of kobe and the lakers though ?
lebron's greater than kobe. maybe his teams aren't, but lebron's been a better player than kobe his entire career.........

the success will come for lebron starting this june. kobe lost twice in the finals too. lebron could win 5 in a row and they'd be even
 5 years ago '06        #96
PG-13 126 heat pts126
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 philly337 said:
Men lie women lie...numbers don't. I like how you skipped the post

Here's a video for you

that first clip
 5 years ago '06        #97
PG-13 126 heat pts126
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 The Bully said:
goddamn philly took the souls of all the kobe stans in this thread:wow:

except fatbury, grease and cholesterol took his soul a long time ago:disdain2:
 5 years ago '05        #98
PussyFiend 
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 SeaJaiye said:
lebron's greater than kobe. maybe his teams aren't, but lebron's been a better player than kobe his entire career.........

the success will come for lebron starting this june. kobe lost twice in the finals too. lebron could win 5 in a row and they'd be even

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the sad part is that you lebron stans really believe what you type.....

all the legends prefer kobe over LeBrick ....even players that have actually played with the two (SHAQ)

save the anger and take out on something else...cus the points you are trying to make are given absolutely zero fu*ks about...



[pic - click to view]

 02-09-2012, 10:47 PM         #99
SeaJaiye 
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 pus*yFiend said:

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the sad part is that you lebron stans really believe what you type.....

all the legends prefer kobe over LeBrick ....even players that have actually played with the two (SHAQ)

save the anger and take out on something else...cus the points you are trying to make are given absolutely zero fu*ks about...
do u watch basketball? i think u only watch the finals every year. u cant even defend kobe the right way those same legends have already said lebron can go down as the greatest ever and is the most talented player ever so................

this thread was about kobe's poor performances in the 4th this year.............notice how u ignore all that?? all of a sudden, the facts dont matter
 5 years ago '10        #100
Akira Son Bio 205 heat pts205
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