*Throwback* Jay Z Crying on Hot 97 After Hearing Ether

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 6 years ago '10        #221
uddart 1 heat pts
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 RYLNYC said:
So first it was you claiming I was comparing Jay-Z success to Nas' personal life and when I proved you wrong in clear yellow highlight, NOW you want to void the whole aspect with "they're not competing in that way" -- nice smoke and mirror trick, but that didn't work on me.

Jay-Z and Nas aren't competing in those scopes, but like I said, if you're going to talk about the GOAT, take everything into consideration. Not just their money; their influence on the game, their musical accomplishment, how long they've been in the game, their relevance this day. This isn't a "Jay is richer so he's better" argument. I don't know why I keep saying "overall" and "all accomplishments" and you keep reading "Jay-Z's money."

You want to talk lyricism, again, I like Jay-Z more. His music (song-for-song and album-for-album), his punchlines, his verses, and song concepts trump Nas' music 8 out of 10 times for me.

So to (hopefully) wrap this up soon. The 1st paragraph above explains why Jay-Z is the greatest of all time in my opinion. The 2nd paragraph explains why I think Jay-Z is the better emcee. Neither are facts, needless to say, but the more popular opinion, with good reason.

It's funny you say I'm not developing my point when most of your reply(s) is just to try and sh-t on what I'm saying. Unless your point is "Jay-Z is very successful, but Nas is doing okay for himself" which although is true, is not good enough.

If you want to talk about strictly music, let's disregard everything before and talk about just their music. Why does it take Nas 3-4 years to drop an album while Jay can drop 2 projects in the same year? Why are just MEER TALKS of Jay's next album outshining the 2-3 recent track that Nas dropped? (You're gonna hate this next question, but) Why does Jay sell more every single time?

Your response is probably gonna be along the lines of "just cause Jay is more popular, doesn't mean he's better" -- the fact is, that's a big reason why. Jay makes the better music that appeals to more people, more genres, more artists in the industry, and more demographics. Nas spits some beautiful and real stuff, but he has no versatility, and that's why he'll never have a mass appeal. His claim to fame will forever be "Illmatic" and "Ether," that's it (yeah, "It Was Written" and "Stillmatic" were dope, but they won't compare to "Illmatic").
stop read when jay and goat was in the same sentence
 6 years ago '10        #222
uddart 1 heat pts
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The monster feature on kanyes album was........ Great?
 6 years ago '10        #223
uddart 1 heat pts
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KC and BP 3 was two other failures or looses
 6 years ago '04        #224
RYLNYC|m 5 heat pts
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 uddart said:
stop read when jay and goat was in the same sentence
I expect that from someone whose top 2 is Nas.
 07-17-2011, 05:44 PM         #225
Prophecy_projet 
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 RYLNYC said:
So first it was you claiming I was comparing Jay-Z success to Nas' personal life and when I proved you wrong in clear yellow highlight, NOW you want to void the whole aspect with "they're not competing in that way" -- nice smoke and mirror trick, but that didn't work on me.
You may want to go back and read your first post again, it was pretty cut and dry that you compared both personal lives and success and others called you on it I'm not so sure why you think me questioning that is "smoke and mirrors" ...you tell me: Do you think Nas and Jay are competing on those aspects. Because if they arent activley doing then its really not a competition and it goes back to my original point: Fans bring that up to make themselves feel better aboutt he battle, when really it was focused on songs

 RYLNYC said:
Jay-Z and Nas aren't competing in those scopes, but like I said, if you're going to talk about the GOAT, take everything into consideration. Not just their money; their influence on the game, their musical accomplishment, how long they've been in the game, their relevance this day. This isn't a "Jay is richer so he's better" argument. I don't know why I keep saying "overall" and "all accomplishments" and you keep reading "Jay-Z's money."
Because I'm talking about your orginal comment which you seemed to only talk about Jay's success and use Nas's alimony payments as some sort of perspective on their places. You have to understand if that wasnt a diss, then you need articulate yourself better. For the record if we are talking about those other factors, Nas still checks on those aspects, its not as cut and dry and dissmissive either


 RYLNYC said:
You want to talk lyricism, again, I like Jay-Z more. His music (song-for-song and album-for-album), his punchlines, his verses, and song concepts trump Nas' music 8 out of 10 times for me.

So to (hopefully) wrap this up soon. The 1st paragraph above explains why Jay-Z is the greatest of all time in my opinion. The 2nd paragraph explains why I think Jay-Z is the better emcee. Neither are facts, needless to say, but the more popular opinion, with good reason.

It's funny you say I'm not developing my point when most of your reply(s) is just to try and sh-t on what I'm saying. Unless your point is "Jay-Z is very successful, but Nas is doing okay for himself" which although is true, is not good enough.
If you want to rate Jay-Z ahead that's fine but again, I've only taken issue with you dismissing Nas's non-Illmatic catalogue which you conceded was wrong and I didnt agree with the notion that one's alimony case vs another's career is a structured argument. You didnt really break either one down in non-partisanship just a lot of general cliches.

Also, lets consider Nas situation of doing okay for himself: Those 7 plat and 2 gold records (not even counting the side projects) is pretty impressive, I dont see how anyone with a grasp of how fickle the Hip Hop genre can be doesnt take a step gets some perspective and see that's is good enough, its literally a notch below LL, Snoop and Jay in terms of major label longevity.



 RYLNYC said:

If you want to talk about strictly music, let's disregard everything before and talk about just their music. Why does it take Nas 3-4 years to drop an album while Jay can drop 2 projects in the same year? Why are just MEER TALKS of Jay's next album outshining the 2-3 recent track that Nas dropped? (You're gonna hate this next question, but) Why does Jay sell more every single time?
I'm not quite sure where you got the impression Nas takes 3-4 years to drop an album, last I check he drops an album every 2 years more or less and tours extensivley in between (Iam/Nastradamus 1999, Stillmatic 2001, God Son 2002, Streets Disciple 2004, HHID 2006, Untitled 2008 and Distant Relatives 2010...7 albums in 12 years is an above average output rate.).

As for why Jay sells more? He makes more radio records and Nas doesnt and has been like that since 1998. He promotes himself and creates a brand, whereas Nasis more an artist who experiments with concepts and narrations from album to album.

Here's what makes Nas's career impressive anyway: He got his recent success without heavy radio and promotion. His last 2 albums went straight in at number 1 on the billboard charts (HHID even did 355k first week and outsold Miley Cyrus....in this disneyfied American retail market, how the hell did that happen?). Even Distant Relatives was an international success and he was able to headline and sell out Wembly Arena in London this past March as well as major US and international festivals with it....how on earth does that happen with a reggae album that got no push on your mainstream?
So you have to look at it from the perspective of what Nas has been able to achieve without as much resources and self planning and its a career a lot of people, even dudes who are hotter than him have to look at it and be impressed with . For a guy with "one hot album every 10 year average" that's kinda far from lame to be honest.


As for why Jay has more buzz from MERE tracks....he's Jay-Z and he's doing a record with Kanye West. Although the buzz did kinda die down after HAM and things went cold these past months. But its interesting you bring up the buzz comparison, because Nas seems to still be getting legit buzz and talk anyway. I dont see it as Jay "stealing" his buzz or thunder. Everytime Nas dropped a new track it was trending worldwide on twitter, you see it on the internet and even in Barbershops and in colleges there's a legit talk and buzz about Nas, now he just has to keep going as he has been. People always talk about Nas.

As for Outshining him? I dont get that impression at all at this moment? I dont get that impression at all. I mean most people were cold on HAM whereas nasty and Ghetto Dreams have sparked legit conversations about where Nas is at right now.





 RYLNYC said:
Your response is probably gonna be along the lines of "just cause Jay is more popular, doesn't mean he's better" -- the fact is, that's a big reason why. Jay makes the better music that appeals to more people, more genres, more artists in the industry, and more demographics. Nas spits some beautiful and real stuff, but he has no versatility, and that's why he'll never have a mass appeal. His claim to fame will forever be "Illmatic" and "Ether," that's it (yeah, "It Was Written" and "Stillmatic" were dope, but they won't compare to "Illmatic").
No one's arguing that Jay has a wider appeal, which is mostly built on his creativity but also a lot on his networking (For instance that Linkin Park collabo was terrible, but it worked because he was able to push the record with Universal despite being a blend tape).

But what I'm saying is Nas isnt some C-Class level local New York MC either. He's not exactly E-40 East.

And lets be honest: You and I know people who we wouldnt consider hardcore heads who still have heard Nas records they liked, whether it be Hate Me Now, If I Ruled the World, Made You Look even that kiddie I Can record. How else has he been able to do Bonnarroo, SXSW, Coachella, Lollapolloza and tons of colleges with solo stuff and a reggae record? Clearly he has some mass appeal if he's in demand to do those shows on the main stage, right?

Kanye West said it himself on the Glow In The Dark Tour in 2008: He said Nas was the best MC of his generation and it was because to him, he thought Nas was diverse.

"Nas was the type of n*gga to do a song with Wu-Tang and then do a radio record with Puffy the same day and it would work". That may not seem like a strech nowadays but it kinda was and still is. The only issue is that some people bemoan it because there is always going to be that Illmatic/backpacker audience that views Nas in one way and others in another way. But really he's been doing this for 15 years juggling different records and he's still here, still on a major label so he must be successful at it even if musically people argue about it all the time amongst themselves.

I think he's been far more than just the Illmatic and Ether guy. Those maybe his most remembered moments, but he's had others too. Whether it was the mafioso turn of the mid 90s, the constant Primo collabortions, The Firm and introducing of the New Queensbridge generation in the 90s, to boldly bringing a boom bap single back with Made You Look, to being nominated for an MTV Video of the Year (overall) for an unconventional hit single like One Mic, to Hate Me Now being a tunnel and radio anthem still being played today to having kids sing I Can at school recitels in 03 to having people spark up a legit conversation about the state of Hip Hop just with the title of his album. Dude has always had big moments in Hip Hop and thats why he's such a polarizing figure to some and lightining rod for discussion in Hip-Hop to this day.
 6 years ago '05        #226
WaveDoe 12 heat pts12
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 D.S.O.M. said:
nice thread props to the TS


DAMN SHAME THE n*gga AINT HAD A LOSS IN SOO LONG n*ggaS DIG UP OLD BONES JUST TO HATE
............
 6 years ago '10        #227
uddart 1 heat pts
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 RYLNYC said:
I expect that from someone whose top 2 is Nas.
Puting anyones personal life as why someone is goat should be disqualified from this forum
 07-17-2011, 06:19 PM         #228
Gee Bully AAE 
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I THINK THAT EVERYBODY KNOWS THAT JAY LOST THE OVERALL BATTLE, SOME PEOPLE ARE JUST MAD BIASED. IF UR AN ARTIST IN SOME BEEF sh*t, DONT FREESTYLE UR REBUTTLE UNLESS UR A REAL a.ss FREESTYLER AND NOT IF UR A BITING a.ss n*gga LIKE JAY....IMO
 6 years ago '04        #229
Jamaro85 
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One dumbass makes a thread like this and anybody whose favorite artist is Nas gets grouped with them into the stan category. You know well that people make these threads in defense of Jay-Z as well. There's always insecure fans who have to justify their belief that one is greater than the other.
 07-19-2011, 01:46 AM         #230
Gee Bully AAE 
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real sh*t imo jay has his moments and so does nas....but neither is a favorite of mine
 07-19-2011, 01:55 AM         #231
LYRICALDETOX 
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hahaha iHave the other interviewS !!! #classic
 6 years ago '09        #232
CutKidd21 7 heat pts
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 uddart said:
Puting anyones personal life as why someone is goat should be disqualified from this forum
This.


none of us know what is going on in their personal life. That sh*t makes you looks stupid/naive as fu*k and young as hell.


Strictly diss records, ETHER destroyed Jay-Z and the sh*t isn't close


and I don't even listen to nas
 6 years ago '06        #233
Storchaveli 94 heat pts94
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 CutKidd21 said:
This.


none of us know what is going on in their personal life. That sh*t makes you looks stupid/naive as fu*k and young as hell.


Strictly diss records, ETHER destroyed Jay-Z and the sh*t isn't close


and I don't even listen to nas
But Jay is married to someone famous... But but he wears cool clothes...but but he has money... fu*kin idiots. Take away the money, the wife, the "image" and look at his technique and you have a basic style. Nothing more, nothing less.
 07-21-2011, 06:54 PM         #234
FiveFingerRing 
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Did he really cry? I didn't hear it.
 6 years ago '07        #235
KnicksLost 17 heat pts17
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 FiveFingerRing said:
Did he really cry? I didn't hear it.
he didn't cry but he got choked up on the air..and angie martinez laughed at him
 07-23-2011, 12:58 PM         #236
Haze_Reloaded 
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Nas won get mad
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