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 7 years ago '04        #61
ShaDoW1 7 heat pts
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i dont understand why theres debate..im one of the hardcore bulls fans but rose isnt a great defender yet, hes decent but i think thibs covers up a lot of his defense woos
 7 years ago '05        #62
Hold That 103 heat pts103 OP
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 servesurite said:
illuminati possibility?

[pic - click to view]


The illuminati handshake..
 7 years ago '09        #63
That Guy Fly 21 heat pts21
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 ShaDoW1 said:
i dont understand why theres debate..im one of the hardcore bulls fans but rose isnt a great defender yet, hes decent but i think thibs covers up a lot of his defense woos
you're a rational fan unlike the rest of the people being addressed on this site. Them n*ggas see no wrong even when its 8 feet tall, 10 feet wide got a big a.ss sign on it that says so and refers to them as son or baby. They still dont see it.

Props to you for being a rational fan though.
 7 years ago '06        #64
RayG210 43 heat pts43
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what's a goon to a goblin.
 7 years ago '05        #65
Hold That 103 heat pts103 OP
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 Fly 2ndComing said:
you're a rational fan unlike the rest of the people being addressed on this site. Them n*ggas see no wrong even when its 8 feet tall, 10 feet wide got a big a.ss sign on it that says so and refers to them as son or baby. They still dont see it.

Props to you for being a rational fan though.
This aint being rational Rose has improved leaps and bounds from his rookie year.. If you've watched all the games you can see it.. To say Rose is anything less than a average defender is stupid... To say he's an ELITE defender is stupid.. He's a very good defender, and some of his biggest critics in the media, have also said his improvements on defense has been impressive.. To think that the Bulls or Thibs can mask the PG flaws WHILE HAVING BOOZER ON THE COURT ALSO ALONG WITH BOGANS, is a gross exaggeration along with downplaying Roses achievements and the work he's put in at improving..

The importance of his defensive efforts are on full display in the past 2 games is where Rose had lapses and we suffered our toughest losses of the year.. Rose normally hasn't had these defensive lapses this year, which is why we havent had these poor defensive efforts like this recently.. The PG position defensively is the second most important position next to the Center spot, in Thibs offense. You can't really "hide" or "mask" that, and I would LOVE for someone to sit here and tell me how it's being masked.. Here's your chance to elaborate and show off your BBIQ... Because this should be funny to see you try and explain it.

I can sit here and stop joking and really break down the Bulls defense and show you the importance of Rose has been to our defense, and why he's been important in Noah's absence.. But whats the point, because the last 2 games seem to erase away all his defensive strides he's made in the previous 50+ games..

It's silly, its stupid, but it's a typical knee jerk what have you done for me lately, lets pile on while they are slumping BXSC reaction...


Last edited by Hold That; 02-08-2011 at 09:55 PM..
 7 years ago '06        #66
Bouncer 16 heat pts16
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this thread is comedy
 7 years ago '09        #67
That Guy Fly 21 heat pts21
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 Hold That said:
This aint being rational Rose has improved leaps and bounds from his rookie year.. If you've watched all the games you can see it.. To say Rose is anything less than a average defender is stupid... To say he's an ELITE defender is stupid.. He's a very good defender, and some of his biggest critics in the media, have also said his improvements on defense has been impressive..

I can sit here and stop joking and really break down the Bulls defense and show you the importance of Rose has been to our defense, and why he's been important in Noah's absence.. But whats the point, because the last 2 games seem to erase away all his defensive strides he's made in the previous 50+ games..

It's silly, its stupid, but it's a typical knee jerk what have you done for me lately, lets pile on while they are slumping BXSC reaction...
Nobody said he hadnt improved as a defender. Anybody that has watched him since he entered college until now should know he has improved. Especially since Thibs has taken over. But, he still is a terrible one on one defender and misses a.ssignments as a team defender. But, he is improving because at least now he gets frustrated when he f**ks up on defense.
That wasnt always the case.
 7 years ago '05        #68
Hold That 103 heat pts103 OP
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 Fly 2ndComing said:
Nobody said he hadnt improved as a defender. Anybody that has watched him since he entered college until now should know he has improved. Especially since Thibs has taken over. But, he still is a terrible one on one defender and misses a.ssignments as a team defender. But, he is improving because at least now he gets frustrated when he f**ks up on defense.
That wasnt always the case.
He's not a terrible one on one defender the f**k are you talking about? He gives up the fewest points per position out of any PG.. Now I can show you a direct stat to that.. That doesn't mean he's the best overall defender, but that pretty much squashes the notion that his man defense is terrible. Since the Points per possession stat is a direct reflection on one on one man defense.

With that said, Rose struggles with pick and roll defense along with Boozer, THATS his weakness... f!ghting through screens, and biting on pump fakes.. All that other s**t you mentioned he's actually pretty good at.. This is how i know you don't really know what you talking about..


GSW knew this and ran tons of pick and rolls with Curry or Monta, same with Aldridge and Miller last night..
And guess what, we are about to see CP3 and Deron in the next two games who are absolute monsters at pick in roll game.. So we'll see if Derrick has improved or show the effort in f!ghting through those screens and recovering from being picked.. Or not bite on pump fakes etc..

As far as staying in front of his man and not getting blown by, he's pretty damn good at that, his lateral quickness is elite.


Last edited by Hold That; 02-08-2011 at 10:01 PM..
 7 years ago '06        #69
Bouncer 16 heat pts16
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 Hold That said:
He's not a terrible one on one defender the f**k are you talking about? He gives up the fewest points per position out of any PG.. Now I can show you a direct stat to that.. That doesn't mean he's the best overall defender, but that pretty much squashes the notion that his man defense is terrible. Since the Points per possession stat is a direct reflection on one on one man defense.

With that said, Rose struggles with pick and roll defense along with Boozer, THATS his weakness... f!ghting through screens, and biting on pump fakes.. All that other s**t you mentioned he's actually pretty good at.. This is how i know you don't really know what you talking about..


GSW knew this and ran tons of pick and rolls with Curry or Monta, same with Aldridge and Miller last night..
And guess what, we are about to see CP3 and Deron in the next two games who are absolute monsters at pick in roll game.. So we'll see if Derrick has improved or show the effort in f!ghting through those screens and recovering from being picked.. Or not bite on pump fakes etc..

As far as staying in front of his man and not getting blown by, he's pretty damn good at that, his lateral quickness is elite.
quick question n*gga, is rose better than lebron?
 7 years ago '05        #70
Hold That 103 heat pts103 OP
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 Bouncer said:
quick question n*gga, is rose better than lebron?
Rose isn't in my top 5 yet so what you think? I currently have only LeBron/Wade/Howard/Kobe Durant ahead of Rose... I think he will surpass either Wade or Kobe next season(not both but he's going to surpass one of them).

I say Kobe because he's breaking down quickly..

I say Wade because he's quickly approaching his style of play and if he gets to the line more he will have surpassed him based on being younger, and Wade accepting a lesser role.

I'm a huge Rose stan which is obvious, but I TRY, to make predictions and keep it rational with his weaknesses and what he can and can not do.. I might be a little aggressive, but he's no LeBron James.

Think about it though, many of the Bulls fans said Rose was better than Joe Johnson last year and got laughed at..

Many of us said this summer he would be top 10, and got laughed at..

Many of said he would be MVP or atleast have a damn good shot at winning it, and got laughed at..

Many of us said he would drop 24ppg 8ast and got laughed at..

I've built a reputation around here by being some huge Rose stan who makes says crazy things about Rose that he's the best player in the universe or something along those lines.. Well the first part of me being a "Stan" is true, the second part I've or other Bulls fans have been doing nothign but being spot on about our predictions and people STILL, mocking us, like we talking crazy about Rose.. When everything we've said has come to fruition..

I dare someone find one thing we said about Rose would do this year that hasn't come to light, the predictions might seem crazy to one who doesn't watch alot of his games or isn't a Bulls fan, but honestly the prediction are very small and realistic if you did actually watch his games, and you would be less shocked or yell "stan!!" if you was use to seeing him on a nightly basis...


Last edited by Hold That; 02-08-2011 at 10:15 PM..
 7 years ago '06        #71
Bouncer 16 heat pts16
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 Hold That said:
Rose isn't in my top 5 yet so what you think? I currently have only LeBron/Wade/Howard/Kobe Durant ahead of Rose... I think he will surpass either Wade or Kobe next season(not both but he's going to surpass one of them).

I say Kobe because he's breaking down quickly..

I say Wade because he's quickly approaching his style of play and if he gets to the line more he will have surpassed him based on being younger, and Wade accepting a lesser role.

I'm a huge Rose stan which is obvious, but I TRY, to make predictions and keep it rational with his weaknesses and what he can and can not do.. I might be a little aggressive, but he's no LeBron James.

Think about it though, many of the Bulls fans said Rose was better than Joe Johnson last year and got laughed at..

Many of us said this summer he would be top 10, and got laughed at..

Many of said he would be MVP or atleast have a damn good shot at winning it, and got laughed at..

Many of us said he would drop 24ppg 8ast and got laughed at..

I've built a reputation around here by being some huge Rose stan who makes says crazy things about Rose that he's the best player in the universe or something along those lines.. Well the first part of me being a "Stan" is true, the second part I've or other Bulls fans have been doing nothign but being spot on about our predictions and people STILL, mocking us, like we talking crazy about Rose.. When everything we've said has come to fruition..

I dare someone find one thing we said about Rose would do this year that hasn't come to light, the predictions might seem crazy to one who doesn't watch alot of his games or isn't a Bulls fan, but honestly the prediction are very small and realistic if you did actually watch his games, and you would be less shocked or yell "stan!!" if you was use to seeing him on a nightly basis...
s**t i responded than saw u edited it, so i had to delete to repost.

yea, i'm just asking cuz i do agree with most of the s**t you say about rose (top 2 pg imo), but sometimes u go a lil overboard, which is understandable since you yourself admit you're a stan, but i just asked to make sure you weren't gonna be unrealistic

im no bulls fan, but rose > joe johnson, id take rose over him any damn day, only thing jj got over rose is a 3pt shot.

he is having a great year, but i honestly dont think he'll win mvp, atleast not this year. lebron is having an amazing year himself with the same stats as last year with a better team. (except his ppg is a bit down)

rose is top 10 for sure, anyone who says otherwise is either not a basketball fan or a celtics fan and i also don't follow all the bulls games like im sure you do, but when i do watch chicago you can clearly tell that rose is top 2 pg in the league. other than D-will imo no one is f**king with rose.

westbrook? i like him too, but he has a top 3 player in durant on his squad which helps him cuz he aint the primary focus

cp3? hes nice, but i would still take rose over him

nash? too old

rondo? i cannot wait to see when the big 3 retire
 7 years ago '05        #72
Hold That 103 heat pts103 OP
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I honestly feel that if Rose doesn't win it this year, there is no window for anyone else to win it against LeBron in the next 5 years.. He's not going to slow down, his stats will remain constant, and it will be the same s**t over and over with LeBron winning the MVP.. Something that they didn't allow Jordan to do in the 90's because they said the MVP award would become "boring" because Jordan deserved it every year.. MJ should have walked away with 10MVPS instead of 5.... It is what it is though. SHAQ should have more than just 1 along with Kobe..

Yet somehow LeBron still receives this golden boy, preferential treatment, while somehow undermining the rest of the leagues ELITES like Rose/Paul/Howard(who had another 20 20 game), as if they mean nothing to LeBron yet another lofty stat filled game, with Wade and Bosh waiting in the wings to carry him when he f**ks up in a couple of games..

The NBA needs a new MVP.. The MVP doesn't mean the best player, just who's the most valueable to the team, propelling them to heights they wouldn't dare to accomplish without that person or wouldn't be close to doing such.. Bron already recieved MVP for playing with that wack a.ss Cavs team last year, but every seems so dead set for giving him another one because they are trash this year.. As if this year has anything to do with the Current star stacked Miami team.. Thats just my outlook on it.. I'd be fine with Howard winning it, hell he's the best defensive player in the game, and getting 20 20 games every other day, and doesn't get half the respect. Funny how that works. If you take Howard or Rose off the magic or Bulls they wouldn't be any better than 7th seed in the East. Yet with those two they are being talked in the likes of a stacked Miami and Boston team.


Last edited by Hold That; 02-08-2011 at 10:47 PM..
 7 years ago '09        #73
That Guy Fly 21 heat pts21
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 Hold That said:
He's not a terrible one on one defender the f**k are you talking about? He gives up the fewest points per position out of any PG.. Now I can show you a direct stat to that.. That doesn't mean he's the best overall defender, but that pretty much squashes the notion that his man defense is terrible. Since the Points per possession stat is a direct reflection on one on one man defense.

With that said, Rose struggles with pick and roll defense along with Boozer, THATS his weakness... f!ghting through screens, and biting on pump fakes.. All that other s**t you mentioned he's actually pretty good at.. This is how i know you don't really know what you talking about..


GSW knew this and ran tons of pick and rolls with Curry or Monta, same with Aldridge and Miller last night..
And guess what, we are about to see CP3 and Deron in the next two games who are absolute monsters at pick in roll game.. So we'll see if Derrick has improved or show the effort in f!ghting through those screens and recovering from being picked.. Or not bite on pump fakes etc..

As far as staying in front of his man and not getting blown by, he's pretty damn good at that, his lateral quickness is elite.
I dont need the numbers, I have a synergy account and know what they say. But, that takes into account all his defensive possessions. There are plenty of empty possessions in a game defensively based on that. Like say he picks up a man quickly in transition but they score without setting up offense, thats considered a defensive stop. You would have to go deeper into the numbers and plays to see what he does against his position on a play when that player is in attempts to try to score being aggressive instead of just initiating a play for someone else.


All numbers can be skewed to say whatever anybody wants to say but actual evidence through watching a game he has a lot still to work on defensively. But, I like where he has come from because it shows he wants to get better.
 7 years ago '06        #74
Bouncer 16 heat pts16
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 Hold That said:
I honestly feel that if Rose doesn't win it this year, there is no window for anyone else to win it against LeBron in the next 5 years.. He's not going to slow down, his stats will remain constant, and it will be the same s**t over and over with LeBron winning the MVP.. Something that they didn't allow Jordan to do in the 90's because they said the MVP award would become "boring" because Jordan deserved it every year.. MJ should have walked away with 10MVPS instead of 5.... It is what it is though. SHAQ should have more than just 1 along with Kobe..

Yet somehow LeBron still receives this golden boy, preferential treatment, while somehow undermining the rest of the leagues ELITES like Rose/Paul/Howard(who had another 20 20 game), as if they mean nothing to LeBron yet another lofty stat filled game, with Wade and Bosh waiting in the wings to carry him when he f**ks up in a couple of games..

The NBA needs a new MVP.. The MVP doesn't mean the best player, just who's the most valueable to the team, propelling them to heights they wouldn't dare to accomplish without that person or wouldn't be close to doing such.. Bron already recieved MVP for playing with that wack a.ss Cavs team last year, but every seems so dead set for giving him another one because they are trash this year.. As if this year has anything to do with the Current star stacked Miami team.. Thats just my outlook on it.. I'd be fine with Howard winning it, hell he's the best defensive player in the game, and getting 20 20 games every other day, and doesn't get half the respect. Funny how that works. If you take Howard or Rose off the magic or Bulls they wouldn't be any better than 7th seed in the East. Yet with those two they are being talked in the likes of a stacked Miami and Boston team.
if lebron doesn't get the mvp, it sure as hell shouldn't b howard. i think dude is wack. for his size he should b getting 20 and 20 every damn game.

n*gga got like 1 post move.
 7 years ago '09        #75
That Guy Fly 21 heat pts21
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 gangtsa said:
Yep just a couple years ago Ray allen also posted elite defensive numbers at the 2 spot. LIke fly mentioned numbers can be skewed to look one way and of course other players can help those numbers.
Hell yeah, Tony Parker is a s**t defender but nobody calls him out because the Spurs hide him well. Ray Allen was a s**t defender before he got to Boston but their team defense hid him well. Just depends on what is happening. Rose has gotten better individually and with Thibs their team is in a long process of making a lot of notoriously bad individual defenders good as a collective unit. They are getting there and once Noah comes back they should take off defensively.
 7 years ago '05        #76
Hold That 103 heat pts103 OP
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 gangtsa said:
Yep just a couple years ago Ray allen also posted elite defensive numbers at the 2 spot. LIke fly mentioned numbers can be skewed to look one way and of course other players can help those numbers.
This is true when you have a team with KG Perkins and Rondo who can mask a weak defensive players flaws..

If Ray Allens man beats him off the dribble, KG and Perkins usually cleaned up the mistake and met him at the rim... A system can mask a players weaknesses, BUT it takes a couple of players in that system to help mask that one weak player..

Nobody is going to sit here and tell me an Old Kurt Thomas and a notoriously defensively bad Boozer is masking Roses flaws.. That arguement doesn't work with the Bulls.. Rose himself has stepped up his defense, outside of his past 2 games..

Notice when Rose has defensive lapses we lose, so him putting in a good defensive effort is VITAL for our defense and our success.. Augustine had a big game against him, we lost.. Same with Curry and Miller..

Rose can't afford to have defensive lapses nor is our team capable of masking anything with Boozer/Kurt in the backcourt.. So this arguement is really not valid just based upon our team makeup. And another wing player can not mask another wing players defensive lapses because they are on the opposite sides of the court.. Only a big man can mask a defensive weakness of a wing.

This is why I say Roses defense has improved leaps and bounds, and its been more telling that it has when you point to these uncharacteristic losses the Bulls had recently.


Last edited by Hold That; 02-08-2011 at 11:53 PM..
 02-09-2011, 02:37 AM         #77
danflan 
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Batum is a nice kid ive met him at a few Blazer events he seems like the last guy to talk trash.
 02-09-2011, 05:29 AM         #78
atl12o13 
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 agony8 said:
why u stealing rondo nickname...
Rondo is nice,but you cant be point god until you get that free throw % above Shaq's.Cant even put the ball in your pg's hands to run the clock out....plus Rose took that mans soul when they played each other last month,is the starter in the all star game,started on the world team Rondo got cut from,and i PROMISE you,if Chicago offered Boston Rose for Rondo straight up,they would throw Rondo a.ss off the bus while it was still moving.
 02-09-2011, 05:33 AM         #79
atl12o13 
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 beast mode said:
having 2 n*ggaz roll with you means you have goons??? n*ggaz got gun license and is his security now meaning them n*ggaz ain't got no records. having a gun doesn't make you a goon or else they're MILLION and MILLIONS of goons out there.
AGAIN....where were they when his got his a.ss beat???? rose has body guards now cuz he got f**ked up

Im not sayin Rose hard,but you act like you cant be tough and still lose a f!ght...Yall dudes need to get all that air out your internet chests.Like everyone in this thread is busting heads.
 7 years ago '10        #80
renothebest 1 heat pts
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 beast mode said:
this n*ggaz mad his idol got his a.ss MANGLED!!!!
n*gga u mad cus rose got more goons then bosh wade and bron combined.. you b**ch a.ss n*ggaa



ROZAYYYYYY THATS MY NICKNAME!


ROZAY IS THE MOST GOONISH PLAYER IN THE NBA

REAL n*ggaS MOVE IN SILENCE
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