what has shaq done witout penny, kobe, wade, lebron? lol. There's a reason why lakers weren't doing s**t in the playoffs until kobe got better.
Without Penny, he won a chip with Kobe, without Kobe he won a chip with D-Wade, and after D-Wade his career was over so I dont care about the Lebron and Phoenix fiascos. But no Center has ever gotten it done alone, so Shaq always needed that great 2G, and it worked well in his career. Remember even though Shaq used to bicker with Kobe alot, he wanted to play with Kobe, but their personalities clashed too much and it ended...
come on homie you just arguing for the sake of arguing now. when he went to denver they got knocked out the first round two years in a row. they trade him to detroit and getting billups and go to the conference finals. im sure you'll find an excuse for that but it is what it is. im not knocking iverson im a sixers fan and he is my favorite player ever, but what im saying is something that every sixers fan knows because we watched the guy and the team for 11 years here and saw how he operated.
Logically thinking.. Did Iverson lose both times in the first round to LA? All Denver did that year was get the 2nd seed and didnt have to play LA til the CONF Finals, when they went ahead and lost to the Lakers, I honestly dont see much of a difference except the CONF FINALS team didnt get swept.
I stated that the fact that he is 6' tall means that he had a disadvantage when it comes to being a complete player. He can't possibly do all the things that Kobe does. As a scorer, yes Iverson is great, but he wasn't great at anything else. Kobe is a great scorer as well, and a more complete basketball player. In addition to scoring, he can do things that Iverson isn't capable of. Also, I just left a thread about Magic Johnson saying Rondo was the best PG in NBA. In that thread someone says that D. Rose was a better player than Rondo, and that Rondo was playing so well because he was playing with 3 HOFers. You then responded by saying, and I quote
"My point is stop talking about "WHAT IF" and "BECAUSE THIS" and "HE HAS THIS" and deal with the Facts... Rondo plays with KG, PP, and RA thats it get over it. D.Rose plays with Joakim Noah, while individual talent D.Rose > Rondo (Rondo being my favorite player I can admit it) but.. because of their teams and their success Rondo > Rose...".
Yet in this thread you listed 20 plus players that you believed to better than Kobe, most of which haven't accomplished half of what Kobe has, nor are they as talented as Kobe.
Yea but take the ERA most of them played in.. Most played in Jordans glory days, and the rest played in KOBE & SHAQS glory days. I mean Malone and Stockton went to back to back finals,only lose to the same man twice. Barkley lost to Mike in the Finals.. Barkley's a MVP, Malones a MVP. Everybody on my list is an ALL-STAR.. Maybe they werent lucky enough to share the same team success as Kobe, but all in their PRIMES were PRIMETIME players.
Like I said Kobe is a great talent, but he gets better with great players around him.. I cant knock him for that.. But I got to see 2 Kobes. The Kobe that couldnt get it done, and the Kobe that could. You guys seem to not want to acknowledge the Kobe that COULDNT, and only want to focus on the KOBE that could. Think about when Gasol got to LA, what seed were they? I think they were like 4th or 5th.. Gasol came in and they finished the season what? 27-5 or something crazy like that. And since then its been back to back to back finals apperances, and the no.1 seed what 3 years in a row now? Other players help elevate Kobes game and its not a knock on him, but I just cant give him all the credit like you guys do. I'm sorry.