Why We Think Lebron > Kobe

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 8 years ago '04        #321
Mat The W 
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 str8_akademiks said:
People have really short memories...

I don't even wanna beat a dead horse but Kobe was amazing @ 24 as well.
And he was by far the more skilled player at the same age.
Kobe @ 24

[pic - click to view]


3 NBA Championships, 5 all-star games, 2 time All Defensive 1st Team, 2 time All Defensive 2nd Team, 2 time All-NBA 1st team, 2 time All-NBA 2nd team, 1 time All-NBA 3rd Team

Lebron @ 24

[pic - click to view]



5 all-star games, 1 time All-Defensive 1st team, 3 time All NBA 1st team, 2 time All NBA 2nd team, NBA MVP, ROY


yup Kobe was amazing @24:agreement6::agreement6::agreement6::agreement6 ::agreement6:
 8 years ago '09        #322
TheG1ftedOne 4 heat pts
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 Mat The W said:
Kobe @ 24

[pic - click to view]


3 NBA Championships, 5 all-star games, 2 time All Defensive 1st Team, 2 time All Defensive 2nd Team, 2 time All-NBA 1st team, 2 time All-NBA 2nd team, 1 time All-NBA 3rd Team

Lebron @ 24

[pic - click to view]



5 all-star games, 1 time All-Defensive 1st team, 3 time All NBA 1st team, 2 time All NBA 2nd team, NBA MVP, ROY


yup Kobe was amazing @24:agreement6::agreement6::agreement6::agreement6 ::agreement6:
And they said Lebron was way more productive than Kobe in the same point of their careers...
 8 years ago '09        #323
Knowledgeable 29 heat pts29
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 Mat The W said:
Kobe @ 24

[pic - click to view]


3 NBA Championships, 5 all-star games, 2 time All Defensive 1st Team, 2 time All Defensive 2nd Team, 2 time All-NBA 1st team, 2 time All-NBA 2nd team, 1 time All-NBA 3rd Team

Lebron @ 24

[pic - click to view]



5 all-star games, 1 time All-Defensive 1st team, 3 time All NBA 1st team, 2 time All NBA 2nd team, NBA MVP, ROY


yup Kobe was amazing @24:agreement6::agreement6::agreement6::agreement6 ::agreement6:

:owned:
 8 years ago '09        #324
Lil Jay 30 heat pts30
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 07-31-2009, 02:39 PM         #325
A.O.™ 
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 Mat The W said:
Kobe @ 24
3 NBA Championships, 5 all-star games, 2 time All Defensive 1st Team, 2 time All Defensive 2nd Team, 2 time All-NBA 1st team, 2 time All-NBA 2nd team, 1 time All-NBA 3rd Team
Lebron @ 24
5 all-star games, 1 time All-Defensive 1st team, 3 time All NBA 1st team, 2 time All NBA 2nd team, NBA MVP, ROY
yup Kobe was amazing @24:agreement6::agreement6::agreement6::agreement6 ::agreement6:
So those stats matter...

And these dont

 hbk83 said:
both out of high school FIRST 6 SEASONS NO COMPARISON
KOBE
PPG REB AS STL FG%
7.6 1.9 1.3 0.7 .417
15.1 3.1 2.5 0.9 .428
19.9 5.3 3.8 1.4 .465
22.5 6.3 4.9 1.6 .468
28.5 5.8 5.0 1.7 .464
25.2 5.5 5.5 1.5 .469

LEBRON
PPG RB AS ST FG%
20.9 5.5 5.9 1.6 .417
27.2 7.4 7.2 2.2 .472
31.4 7.0 6.6 1.6 .480
27.3 6.8 6.0 1.6 .476
30.0 7.9 7.2 1.8 .484
28.4 7.6 7.2 1.7 .489

Even though the actual on court performance is dominated by Lebron. And those lead to your All-Star games, and all-defensive teams and s**t of that nature.
 07-31-2009, 03:06 PM         #326
billieskeet 
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 A.O.™ said:
So those stats matter...

And these dont




Even though the actual on court performance is dominated by Lebron. And those lead to your All-Star games, and all-defensive teams and s**t of that nature.
Look at it this way, if you won the scoring title 10 times in a row, then look at another guy won a nba championship 10 times in a row. Which do you think matters more? I mean for this to even be a plausible discussion to me, Lebron has to first at least get 1 ring. To me Lebron is not even in D-Whistle's class, let alone Kobe. Lebron is still wit Carmelo and Chris Bosh to me.
 8 years ago '05        #327
hbk83 1 heat pts OP
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 billieskeet said:
Look at it this way, if you won the scoring title 10 times in a row, then look at another guy won a nba championship 10 times in a row. Which do you think matters more? I mean for this to even be a plausible discussion to me, Lebron has to first at least get 1 ring. To me Lebron is not even in D-Whistle's class, let alone Kobe. Lebron is still wit Carmelo and Chris Bosh to me.
Ok well put it this way, when jordan was with the wizards 01-03 he had the best credentials of anyone in the league, f**k he is jordan, but at the time was he still the best player in the league with 6 rings 5 mvp, 6 final mvp all star appearences lol etc.... or was it the then kobe/allen iverson/shaq/tim duncan even though jordan still put up good numbers? he avg 23 6 5, was he better then the best players at that time??

Jordan waited 6 seasons before he won his first ship, cause he came into a team that started building around him, but before he won that ship EVERYONE KNEW HE WAS THE BEST PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE, kobe came into a already made team, he was just a extra piece and became great he wasnt always, he is not jordan or lebron even with the 4 rings cause they dominated from day one . was isiah better because he had rings?? no was bird?? no was magic?? no in 1990 before jordan first title he was known as the best player in the league, he didnt need a championship, he had
1 nba mvp
1 gold medal
4 scoring titles
roy award
4 first nba selection
4 all star
etc.... now whos resume does that strikingly resemble?
all before his first championship but was still the best player in the league, why would we hold that against lebron??


Last edited by hbk83; 08-01-2009 at 03:32 AM..
 8 years ago '05        #328
StateProperty88 34 heat pts34
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 hbk83 said:
Ok well put it this way, when jordan was with the wizards 01-03 he had the best credentials of anyone in the league, f**k he is jordan, but at the time was he still the best player in the league with 6 rings 5 mvp, 6 final mvp all star appearences lol etc.... or was it the then kobe/allen iverson/shaq/tim duncan even though jordan still put up good numbers? he avg 23 6 5, was he better then the best players at that time??

Jordan waited 6 seasons before he won his first ship, cause he came into a team that started building around him, but before he won that ship EVERYONE KNEW HE WAS THE BEST PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE, kobe came into a already made team, he was just a extra piece . was isiah better because he had rings?? no was bird?? no was magic?? no in 1990 before jordan first title he was known as the best player in the league, he didnt need a championship, he had
1 nba mvp
1 gold medal
4 scoring titles
roy award
4 first nba selection
4 all star
etc....
all before his first championship but was still the best player in the league, why would we hold that against lebron??
because what exactly have kobe done to not make him the best player in the league?
 8 years ago '05        #329
hbk83 1 heat pts OP
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 StateProperty88 said:
because what exactly have kobe done to not make him the best player in the league?
That is what im saying its not what you have done, its just who is the best on the court, you dont have to have had 10 championships to be the best in the league, come on duncan had 4 rings before kevin garnett, but we know if they played one on one, which they did actually kg would k!ll him,and he did, kg beat that whole olymic team in king of the court, i think it was the 2000 team, kevin garnett was a better player, but duncan his higher on all time list cause of the rings, but NO BASKETBALL fan can honestly tell me duncan is a better player, his puzzle pieces fit so he won the championships thats the only reason he is ranked higher, but last season before celtics won the ship we all knew damn kg is better than duncan, f**k a title you can look at the games and say damn lebron is better than kobe. because lebrons highlight reels consist of , dunks, passes, blocks, hustle plays, game winners etc.. if you see a kobe highlight now days its a fade away jumper and an occasional dunk...

And the O sparks verse is my s**t too..


Last edited by hbk83; 08-01-2009 at 03:48 AM..
 8 years ago '05        #330
StateProperty88 34 heat pts34
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 hbk83 said:
That is what im saying its not what you have done, its just who is the best on the court, you dont have to have had 10 championships to be the best in the league, come on duncan had 4 rings before kevin garnett, but we know if they played one on one, which they did actually kg would k!ll him,and he did, kg beat that whole olymic team in king of the court, i think it was the 2000 team, kevin garnett was a better player, but duncan his higher on all time list cause of the rings, but NO BASKETBALL fan can honestly tell me duncan is a better player, his puzzle pieces fit so he won the championships thats the only reason he is ranked higher, but last season before celtics won the ship we all knew damn kg is better than duncan, f**k a title you can look at the games and say damn lebron is better than kobe. because lebrons highlight reels consist of , dunks, passes, blocks, hustle plays, game winners etc.. if you see a kobe highlight now days its a fade away jumper and an occasional dunk...
i dont think you are giving kobe his just due. lets not get it twisted there is a reason that you see a lot of lebron highlights on "BSPN". everyone knows that they ride lebron...that were airing his high school games for god sake. and lebron is much more of a flashier player than kobe which is why i think you see more of his highlights.

fact of the matter is kobe was the best player on the best team last year and is in the prime of his career still. to be honest i think that kobe is at a level that lebron still wants and needs to get to.
 8 years ago '05        #331
hbk83 1 heat pts OP
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 StateProperty88 said:
i dont think you are giving kobe his just due. lets not get it twisted there is a reason that you see a lot of lebron highlights on "BSPN". everyone knows that they ride lebron...that were airing his high school games for god sake. and lebron is much more of a flashier player than kobe which is why i think you see more of his highlights.

fact of the matter is kobe was the best player on the best team last year and is in the prime of his career still. to be honest i think that kobe is at a level that lebron still wants and needs to get to.
I don't mean"highlight" literally, I'm just saying the things he does over the course of the game, its almost like its too easy for him. but no help to win means no help. Lebron on that l.a. team is a 70 win season and a ship, they def would have rocked celtics wit lebron in place of kobe last season.
And to be honest, I really dont think kobe is his best, they won a ship cause there team is better and phil coached his a.ss off, but kobe if you are even a kobe fan can tesity to this, he is not as deadly as he was 2 or 3 years ago, I see this kobe hesitate, and f**k up much more than he used to. I mean you actually see him tire out later in games, you can tell the wear of a 12 season career on him, even though he still is a gret player, but maybe im the only one noticing this

But its why i used the jordan example a couple post ago, jordan greatest player of all time, but was the 01,02 jordan better than the 01'02 kobe, and allen iverson ya know, and he was relevant he avg, 23 6 5. his numbers dipped a lil this year, after playing a full season with gasol, and a good odom, he dont have to do as much, he sat alot also, cause after playing 30 mins or so you see kobe miss alot of shots, thats why you see him doin that s**t wear he dont do much in the first half cause he saving his energy, and a year older with ron artest watch how much he dips again, if you think kobe is the best, I promise this season is the last the world will be thinking, cause i see the decline, its only a matter of time before everyone does


Last edited by hbk83; 08-01-2009 at 08:22 AM..
 08-01-2009, 08:56 AM         #332
A.O.™ 
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 hbk83 said:
That is what im saying its not what you have done, its just who is the best on the court, you dont have to have had 10 championships to be the best in the league, come on duncan had 4 rings before kevin garnett, but we know if they played one on one, which they did actually kg would k!ll him,and he did, kg beat that whole olymic team in king of the court, i think it was the 2000 team, kevin garnett was a better player, but duncan his higher on all time list cause of the rings, but NO BASKETBALL fan can honestly tell me duncan is a better player, his puzzle pieces fit so he won the championships thats the only reason he is ranked higher, but last season before celtics won the ship we all knew damn kg is better than duncan, f**k a title you can look at the games and say damn lebron is better than kobe. because lebrons highlight reels consist of , dunks, passes, blocks, hustle plays, game winners etc.. if you see a kobe highlight now days its a fade away jumper and an occasional dunk...

And the O sparks verse is my s**t too..

Exactly my point... Championships only prove whose the best team, not the best player. Yes the best players on the best teams lead the team to championships. But lets look at Tim Duncan, he's been on the Spurs his whole career, and recently it all depends on Ginoblis health if they do good in the playoffs. Look at the Celtics basically the same team as last year and when KG went down that franchise suffered.

Championships are won by whole teams, not individual players. And a individual players can be better than a player on a championship team.
 8 years ago '04        #333
A.G 27 heat pts27
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 hbk83 said:
I don't mean"highlight" literally, I'm just saying the things he does over the course of the game, its almost like its too easy for him. but no help to win means no help. Lebron on that l.a. team is a 70 win season and a ship, they def would have rocked celtics wit lebron in place of kobe last season.
And to be honest, I really dont think kobe is his best, they won a ship cause there team is better and phil coached his a.ss off, but kobe if you are even a kobe fan can tesity to this, he is not as deadly as he was 2 or 3 years ago, I see this kobe hesitate, and f**k up much more than he used to. I mean you actually see him tire out later in games, you can tell the wear of a 12 season career on him, even though he still is a gret player, but maybe im the only one noticing this
Except for the fact that Lebron sucked worse against Boston than Kobe did..

I guess people tend to forget when a player has statistically the worst 3 game shooting percentage since 1946.
 8 years ago '05        #334
StateProperty88 34 heat pts34
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 A.O.™ said:
Exactly my point... Championships only prove whose the best team, not the best player. Yes the best players on the best teams lead the team to championships. But lets look at Tim Duncan, he's been on the Spurs his whole career, and recently it all depends on Ginoblis health if they do good in the playoffs. Look at the Celtics basically the same team as last year and when KG went down that franchise suffered.

Championships are won by whole teams, not individual players. And a individual players can be better than a player on a championship team.
i partly agree with you. teams win championships, but outside of the pistons of a few years ago i dont think there has been a team that has won a championship without one of the greatest of all time.

rockets- dream
celtic- bird/russell
spurs- duncan
bulls- jordan
etc

so having one of the best player in the league kinda goes hand in hand with the best team


Last edited by StateProperty88; 08-01-2009 at 10:15 AM..
 8 years ago '08        #335
illmatic_kid 9 heat pts
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 StateProperty88 said:
i partly agree with you. teams win championships, but outside of the pistons of a few years ago i dont think there has been a team that has won a championship without one of the greatest of all time.

rockets- dream
celtic- bird/russell
spurs- duncan
bulls- jordan
etc

so having one of the best player in the league kinda goes hand in hand with the best player


Exactly........
 8 years ago '08        #336
illmatic_kid 9 heat pts
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 Mat The W said:
Kobe @ 24

[pic - click to view]


3 NBA Championships, 5 all-star games, 2 time All Defensive 1st Team, 2 time All Defensive 2nd Team, 2 time All-NBA 1st team, 2 time All-NBA 2nd team, 1 time All-NBA 3rd Team

Lebron @ 24

[pic - click to view]



5 all-star games, 1 time All-Defensive 1st team, 3 time All NBA 1st team, 2 time All NBA 2nd team, NBA MVP, ROY


yup Kobe was amazing @24:agreement6::agreement6::agreement6::agreement6 ::agreement6:



.........
 08-01-2009, 10:44 AM         #337
A.O.™ 
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 StateProperty88 said:
i partly agree with you. teams win championships, but outside of the pistons of a few years ago i dont think there has been a team that has won a championship without one of the greatest of all time.

rockets- dream
celtic- bird/russell
spurs- duncan
bulls- jordan
etc

so having one of the best player in the league kinda goes hand in hand with the best team

And I will agree with you all the way, but just because championships are won with great players, dont mean that players cant be great and not have a championship.

Look at David Robinson, he was great early in his playing career, and he squeezed out a championship at the last possible second. Did he become great after the chip even though he was clearly on the decline. He carried the Spurs his whole career, and it took Tim Duncan, and a shorten season for him to win his, do you discredit that ring?

Is Karl Malone not great? Is John Stockton not great? Alot of players arent fortunate to WIN a championship, but atleast they COMPETE for one which in my eyes is also as big as satisfying as winning one.
 8 years ago '05        #338
StateProperty88 34 heat pts34
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 A.O.™ said:
And I will agree with you all the way, but just because championships are won with great players, dont mean that players cant be great and not have a championship.

Look at David Robinson, he was great early in his playing career, and he squeezed out a championship at the last possible second. Did he become great after the chip even though he was clearly on the decline. He carried the Spurs his whole career, and it took Tim Duncan, and a shorten season for him to win his, do you discredit that ring?

Is Karl Malone not great? Is John Stockton not great? Alot of players arent fortunate to WIN a championship, but atleast they COMPETE for one which in my eyes is also as big as satisfying as winning one.
your absolutely right those players you named are great players although they didnt win championships...but why? i say its because of the body of work that they accomplished throughout their career and because of their work they can be COMPARED with the greats and be one as well

However, lebron doesnt have nearly the body of work that those guys have but yet we still want to compare him to the greats, both playing and not. I think the problem is that we are comparing kobe to what we think lebron will eventually become, but not who it currently is.
 8 years ago '09        #339
TheG1ftedOne 4 heat pts
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 str8_akademiks said:
Except for the fact that Lebron sucked worse against Boston than Kobe did..

I guess people tend to forget when a player has statistically the worst 3 game shooting percentage since 1946.
But of course they ignore this comment.... ... Come on Bron fans your just ignoring the bad things and wont respond
 8 years ago '08        #340
illmatic_kid 9 heat pts
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 StateProperty88 said:
your absolutely right those players you named are great players although they didnt win championships...but why? i say its because of the body of work that they accomplished throughout their career and because of their work they can be COMPARED with the greats and be one as well

However, lebron doesnt have nearly the body of work that those guys have but yet we still want to compare him to the greats, both playing and not. I think the problem is that we are comparing kobe to what we think lebron will eventually become, but not who it currently is.
Yep....:applause:
 TheG1ftedOne said:
But of course they ignore this comment.... ... Come on Bron fans your just ignoring the bad things and wont respond

Exactly.....Kobe>>bron..........
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