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 9 years ago '06        #41
SHootar 49 heat pts49 OP
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 GOAAT said:
ur list sucks d**k
good input kiddie...maybe ask ur classmates tmrw at recess and u can improve your contribution tmrw :thumbsdow
 04-20-2009, 04:29 PM         #42
GOAAT 
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Sorry i dont have time to school a kid who thinks ichiro at this point is a better hitter than sizemore. and @ holliday being better.
 9 years ago '06        #43
SHootar 49 heat pts49 OP
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stick to fantasy sports. we're talking about real baseball. continue to make blanket arguments with no substance tho.

there's no question both holliday and ichiro are better hitters than sizemore. ichiro is one of the better hitters the game has seen in the last decade...
 04-20-2009, 04:53 PM         #44
KrayLay 
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 SHootar said:
lol ok. well u go on thinking that guys that hit for high averages and drive runners in are worthless. last time i checked extra base hits don't win games, runs win games. u cannot drive in a run without a hit.


top 10?? lmao

so ...

manny
ortiz
pujols
arod
miguel cabrera
chipper jones
berkman
teixera
holliday
hanley
ichiro


lol i'm gonna stop cuz u've really shown how clueless u are about baseball. i could EASILY name 10-15 more who s**t on sizemore at the plate. leave ur mancrush at home next time.
You're wrong on Ichiro and Holiday. Holliday is not as good as Sizemore away from Coors and he will show you this season.

The only thing Ichiro has on Sizemore is average.

And guess what? That puts Sizemore in the top 10. If you can name 15, I'll be glad to listen.
 04-20-2009, 04:54 PM         #45
KrayLay 
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 SHootar said:
stick to fantasy sports. we're talking about real baseball. continue to make blanket arguments with no substance tho.

there's no question both holliday and ichiro are better hitters than sizemore. ichiro is one of the better hitters the game has seen in the last decade...
Ichiro has been one of the best contact hitters, not overall hitters.
 04-20-2009, 04:56 PM         #46
GOAAT 
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 SHootar said:
stick to fantasy sports. we're talking about real baseball. continue to make blanket arguments with no substance tho.

there's no question both holliday and ichiro are better hitters than sizemore. ichiro is one of the better hitters the game has seen in the last decade...
Watch games and dont just read what espn tells u. Ichiro is past his prime.

If you think hes better than sizemore right now than your smoking on s**t alot stronger than weed.

Holliday has inflated #s from coors. Lets see how does a full yr away from there. not 1 gm in baseball would take holliday over sizemore
 04-20-2009, 04:58 PM         #47
GOAAT 
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 KrayLay said:
You're wrong on Ichiro and Holiday. Holliday is not as good as Sizemore away from Coors and he will show you this season.

The only thing Ichiro has on Sizemore is average.

And guess what? That puts Sizemore in the top 10. If you can name 15, I'll be glad to listen.
s**t id add that as bad as ortiz has looked last year and the start of this year that sizemore is a better hitter than him as well at this point in their careers.
 04-20-2009, 05:04 PM         #48
KrayLay 
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 GOAAT said:
s**t id add that as bad as ortiz has looked last year and the start of this year that sizemore is a better hitter than him as well at this point in their careers.
Ortiz is iffy. I was going on the past three seasons. If he plays like he did last season, then yeah, I'd say Sizemore is better.
 04-20-2009, 05:13 PM         #49
KrayLay 
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[QUOTE=SHootar;13683284]lol ok. well u go on thinking that guys that hit for high averages and drive runners in are worthless. last time i checked extra base hits don't win games, runs win games. u cannot drive in a run without a hit.

You just completely f**king contradicted yourself. You just said extra base hits don't win games, then you said you cannot drive in a run with out a hit? Are you stupid. If team A has 7 hits in one games, going for a total of lets say 23 bases, and team b has 10 hits going for a total of 15 bases, who do you think will score more runs? I hope you don't believe it's team b.

Baseball analysis 101: Do yourself a favor and go on baseball-reference.com or w/e site you enjoy browsing. Go through different years and leagues and find out what team led the league in OPS and what team lead the league in BA. If the two teams are different, look at what team scored more runs. I bet you 9/10 times the team with the higher OPS scored more runs.

Now, RBI and R are a product of a series of events that happened over the course of an inning. Unless a HR is hit, the R or RBI will always (unless home is stolen) occur because of two or more players. That is why is RBI and R is a poor way of evaluating a player's offense. They get sole credit for the RBI or R, but they don't deserve it because if it wasn't for another player (barring a HR) that RBI or R wouldn't be there.
 9 years ago '06        #50
SHootar 49 heat pts49 OP
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 KrayLay said:
You're wrong on Ichiro and Holiday. Holliday is not as good as Sizemore away from Coors and he will show you this season.

The only thing Ichiro has on Sizemore is average.

And guess what? That puts Sizemore in the top 10. If you can name 15, I'll be glad to listen.
ur really gonna sit here and tell me that sizemore is a better hitter than ichiro?? now it seems like ur just listening to some random clown that came in uninvited to this argument lol. but for real, only reason ichiro would look inferior to sizemore from your point of view, is his size and lack of power. but he's obviously a better hitter. his career nums are ridiculous cmon now.

holliday is only u basing it off speculation. even regardless hollidays career ROAD stats are better than sizemore's ROAD stats imo. cuz u can't try to say that it doesn't make a difference playing on the road or at home...lotta hitters flat out hit better at home cuz of a LOT of factors.


i named 11....i can name many more. but the fact that u only have a problem with 2, and many imo would at WORST agree ichiro is a better hitter than sizemore...leads me to believe ur top 10 was just nonsense talk. but i'll be back later to name more but i got s**t to do.
 04-20-2009, 05:19 PM         #51
GOAAT 
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and to clarify i dont think sizemore is a top 10 bat....shootars list was just full of fail.
 04-20-2009, 05:37 PM         #52
KrayLay 
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Here's my list of better hitters than Sizemore since 2006

A-Rod
Pujols
Hanley Ramirez
Manny Ramirez
Chipper Jones
Lance Berkman
David Wright
Miguel Cabrera
Vladimir Guerrero (going forward he isn't better)
David Ortiz (going forward, he probably won't be better either)

Thats off the top.

Beltran is about his equal.

That puts him at about 11th or 12th. I'm still waiting for 15 more guys.

Edit: add Utley, Howard and Teixera


Last edited by KrayLay; 04-20-2009 at 05:50 PM..
 04-20-2009, 05:37 PM         #53
KrayLay 
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 GOAAT said:
and to clarify i dont think sizemore is a top 10 bat....shootars list was just full of fail.
He's about 12 or 13.
 04-20-2009, 05:40 PM         #54
KrayLay 
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 SHootar said:
ur really gonna sit here and tell me that sizemore is a better hitter than ichiro?? now it seems like ur just listening to some random clown that came in uninvited to this argument lol. but for real, only reason ichiro would look inferior to sizemore from your point of view, is his size and lack of power. but he's obviously a better hitter. his career nums are ridiculous cmon now.

holliday is only u basing it off speculation. even regardless hollidays career ROAD stats are better than sizemore's ROAD stats imo. cuz u can't try to say that it doesn't make a difference playing on the road or at home...lotta hitters flat out hit better at home cuz of a LOT of factors.


i named 11....i can name many more. but the fact that u only have a problem with 2, and many imo would at WORST agree ichiro is a better hitter than sizemore...leads me to believe ur top 10 was just nonsense talk. but i'll be back later to name more but i got s**t to do.

Ichiro is a better contact hitter. Sizemore has more power and get on base more. Power and patience>contact.

Sizemore's road OPS is .828, Holliday's is .799.


Last edited by KrayLay; 04-20-2009 at 05:42 PM..
 9 years ago '06        #55
SHootar 49 heat pts49 OP
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 KrayLay said:
Ichiro is a better contact hitter. Sizemore has more power and get on base more. Power and patience>contact.

Sizemore's road OPS is .828, Holliday's is .799.
k i don't have a lot of time right now but will def come back later on


but just off the top ur now backpedalling and admiting hes not a top 10 hitter. so kudos to that at least.

secondly we differ in what measures a better hitter. u simply cannot use OPS as ur only measuring stick. in doing so ur basically saying that all small guys who don't even have the ability to mash 20 homeruns, but are GREAT hitters (ie ichiro) are somehow inferior hitters to guys that hit .260 but will get a higher OPS cuz of their power. i just disagree. u can't just say oh ichiro ain't a great hitter cuz he won't hit for power. so what. if theres a man on 2nd base with 2 outs there are few better hitters that u can count on to drive that run in. probably less than 5 better (pujols, miggy, etc). thats a great hitter.


some more off the top that i think are better hitters than sizemore: mauer (obviously when healthy), wright, youkalis, aramis, utley, pedroia, beltran, kinsler, morneau, hamilton


threes just so many lol. this isn't even my subjective list...this is just straight up these are better hitters.
 04-20-2009, 05:58 PM         #56
KrayLay 
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 SHootar said:
k i don't have a lot of time right now but will def come back later on


but just off the top ur now backpedalling and admiting hes not a top 10 hitter. so kudos to that at least.

secondly we differ in what measures a better hitter. u simply cannot use OPS as ur only measuring stick. in doing so ur basically saying that all small guys who don't even have the ability to mash 20 homeruns, but are GREAT hitters (ie ichiro) are somehow inferior hitters to guys that hit .260 but will get a higher OPS cuz of their power. i just disagree. u can't just say oh ichiro ain't a great hitter cuz he won't hit for power. so what. if theres a man on 2nd base with 2 outs there are few better hitters that u can count on to drive that run in. probably less than 5 better (pujols, miggy, etc). thats a great hitter.


some more off the top that i think are better hitters than sizemore: mauer (obviously when healthy), wright, youkalis, aramis, utley, pedroia, beltran, kinsler, morneau, hamilton


threes just so many lol. this isn't even my subjective list...this is just straight up these are better hitters.
Of course guys who are small with no power aren't as good as the power guys who also get on base. What the f**k? Do what I told you to do with OPS and average. You'll see I'm right.

I'm basing my list off the past three seasons, which I believe is fair. That eliminates Kinsler, Pedroia and Hamilton. Youkilis is not better. He was better last year. Not the past three. Lol @ Aramis...
 9 years ago '06        #57
SHootar 49 heat pts49 OP
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 KrayLay said:
Of course guys who are small with no power aren't as good as the power guys who also get on base. What the f**k? Do what I told you to do with OPS and average. You'll see I'm right.

I'm basing my list off the past three seasons, which I believe is fair. That eliminates Kinsler, Pedroia and Hamilton. Youkilis is not better. He was better last year. Not the past three. Lol @ Aramis...
1. do you not understand the concept of driving runners in?? by your standards you'd prefer a batter hitting .230 with an OBP of .380 over a hitter batting .300 with an OBP of .375. u just don't know what you're talking about bro. this debate is futile. OBP is great to a point. when it comes time to win a ball game and actually put runs on the board, you need a guy who can hit. you cannot count on sizemore to drive runners in, sorry (like the top guys in the majors anyway). you have to hope that the hitters behind him can drive HIM in. in a vacuum, when we don't know how well he's protected by the hitters behind him, the better hitter will prevail as long as is OBP isn't that far behind. learn this bud it will help ur a.ssessments of hitters. right now it seems like ur basing ur analysis on yahoo's big board more than anything..

2. this argument is my opinion vs yours. i've already listed a good 20 names off the top i think are better, and u've only refuted like 6 or 7. clearly ur top 10 nonsense was grossly over-exagerated. sizemore is NOT a top 10 hitter in the majors by ANYONE's standards. fact. stop gassing him like he is.


where's shonuff at...bosox...we need some real baseball heads


Last edited by SHootar; 04-20-2009 at 06:58 PM..
 9 years ago '05        #58
MATIX 
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 Rique said:
not a lot of good black players in baseball. Its like if there was a white superstar in the NBA every white person would love him like they loved the Celtics back in the days
so if theres a black star in the mlb, everyone loves him?

people loved the celtics causs they were good, not white.

put racism to sleep. its beyond old.
 04-20-2009, 07:58 PM         #59
KrayLay 
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1. do you not understand the concept of driving runners in?? by your standards you'd
prefer a batter hitting .230 with an OBP of .380 over a hitter batting .300 with an OBP of .375.
I never said that, and that's an extreme example.

u just don't know what you're talking about bro. this debate is futile. OBP is great to a point. when it comes time to win a ball game and actually put runs on the board, you need a guy who can hit.
OBP consists of hits and walks. Not just walks. A player with an extremely high OBP may not drive in many runs, but he will present a situation that will allow others to knock him in.

you cannot count on sizemore to drive runners in, sorry (like the top guys in the majors anyway).
But you can count on him to score runs. What is the differnce between an RBI and a R? Absolutely nothing because they both wind up as a run on the board. Are you f**king delusional?

you have to hope that the hitters behind him can drive HIM in
.

And you have to hope that people will get on for a batter to drive runners in. Hence the concept of how important OBP is.

in a vacuum, when we don't know how well he's protected by the hitters behind him, the better hitter will prevail as long as is OBP isn't that far behind.
OBP is part of being the better hitter. You're completely f**king wrong.

l
earn this bud it will help ur a.ssessments of hitters. right now it seems like ur basing ur analysis on yahoo's big board more than anything..
shut the f**k up.

[QUOTE]2. this argument is my opinion vs yours. i've already listed a good 20 names off the top i think are better, and u've only refuted like 6 or 7. clearly ur top 10 nonsense was grossly over-exagerated. sizemore is NOT a top 10 hitter in the majors by ANYONE's standards. fact. stop gassing him like he is.


I said probably top 10 in my original post. I was wrong. He is top 12-14. Not top 25 like you said. If you'd like I will present a longer response to the guys that I refuted.

You're clueless.
 9 years ago '06        #60
SHootar 49 heat pts49 OP
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ok u wanna play the OBP game?

add these to the ever expanding list of hitters better than sizemore:

dunn
quentin
markakis
jd drew
hawpe
magglio
jack cust

i'm gonna stop cuz u see how hilarious this can get???

sizemore is just another jack cust...only inferior by your morals. a guy who won't hit for great average, but get on base at a great clip and hit 30 bombs.

jack cust >>>> sizemore

how you gonna deny that with your philosophy??? uh-oh.
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