Feb 5 - 'There Definitely Is A God': Christians Hit Back At Atheist Buses Wit Adverts

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 9 years ago '04        #81
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 r a n c i d said:
I love how you make it sound like you've made a rational decision. When in reality your beliefs are void of all logic
I love how you think the majority of the entire world's beliefs are void of all logic? I may be wrong, but you're saying that 90+% of the world (because they believe in one religion or another) is void of all logic.

 HHS said:
This country was not founded upon Christian beliefs. Do a little research into the religious beliefs of the founding fathers, read the U.S. Constitution.
Against a prevailing view that eighteenth-century Americans had not perpetuated the first settlers' passionate commitment to their faith, scholars now identify a high level of religious energy in colonies after 1700. According to one expert, religion was in the "ascension rather than the declension"; another sees a "rising vitality in religious life" from 1700 onward; a third finds religion in many parts of the colonies in a state of "feverish growth." Figures on church attendance and church formation support these opinions. Between 1700 and 1740, an estimated 75 to 80 percent of the population attended churches, which were being built at a headlong pace.

Toward mid-century the country experienced its first major religious revival. The Great Awakening swept the English-speaking world, as religious energy vibrated between England, Wales, Scotland and the American colonies in the 1730s and 1740s. In America, the Awakening signaled the advent of an encompassing evangelicalism--the belief that the essence of religious experience was the "new birth," inspired by the preaching of the Word. It invigorated even as it divided churches. The supporters of the Awakening and its evangelical thrust--Presbyterians, Baptists and Methodists--became the largest American Protestant denominations by the first decades of the nineteenth century. Opponents of the Awakening or those split by it--Anglicans, Quakers, and Congregationalists--were left behind.




 HHS said:
Our last president said God talked to him about major policy decisions. Might the people of this country have scrutinized him a little more, early on, if he said Santa Claus? It might seem absurd to you to compare God and Santa Claus, but it's not all that different to an atheist. But, because there are so many Christians, it's not a big deal that the president is talking to imaginary beings, as long as he's talking to the right one. Religion restricts critical thought, and offers a simple and clean route to influence people without the use of logic. That's a threat to every person. That's why politicians are so careful to proclaim their religious belief, and have such close ties to religious organizations. The Christian right is on a stated mission to have the laws of this country reflect their religious beliefs. These things are the reason atheists want to even create a seed of doubt.
Most intellegent post thus far. :applause: But this president as well talks to the same imaginary figure in the sky. And don't get it twisted. It's not like Christians are schizophrenic. Through prayer and "talking to imaginary figures in the sky" one seeks to find the answers within him/herself. It's not like we actually hear a voice from the clouds saying, go bomb that country. (Well some might, but that's not the overall aspect of religion). Religion is not a static, unconscious following of teachings of man. It's a dynamic relationship with yourself, God, and our world. People find solace and comfort in prayer, which in turn leads to them evaluating their own opinions and actions.

I still have yet to see how having the words, in God we Trust printed on our money is hurting anyone. It's always been that way, and money doesn't spend any different now than it did before.

 Ya'll f*gs said:
When the LSD was prevalent and the Bible was written.
Um..pretty sure LSD came with Tim Leary wayyyyyy after the bible was written.


Last edited by ItAlY2BkLyN; 02-10-2009 at 10:54 AM..
 9 years ago '04        #82
mista SYN 
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See people would like to say God isn't logical...the idea of a huge arc filled with hundreds of species is illogical, parting the Red Sea is illogical. All logic is, is something that makes sense to us. Faith isn't logic, how many times has a miracle occurred that we've witnessed or heard about? Yet, there is no logical way to explain it. Why is it when things go bad, you always here pray for me, or God help us all. Not believing in God, is like saying If I'm sick don't go to the Doctor, I won't get worse since I don't know what is wrong with me. Last point of thought, I always hear about why Jesus is soooo cruel. How can he allow people to die? What is failed to realize is that we are all here on loan. We were born sinners and sinners are already on the path of condemnation. However, the only way to not fall down that path is to accept the blood of Christ. Jesus is not going to force us to love him, as is evident here, because that would be a form of r*pe...which is why he gave us free will. So I guess everything I'm saying now, is simply going to go in one ear and out the other, but you do you and I'll do me, and we'll find out at the end of the tunnel to see who's right. Once again, you want proof of God's existance, I want proof he doesn't exist!!
 02-10-2009, 10:53 AM         #83
r a n c i d  OP
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:
I love how you think the majority of the entire world's beliefs are void of all logic? I may be wrong, but you're saying that 90+% of the world (because they believe in one religion or another) is void of all logic.
That's exactly what i'm saying.

Numbers are irrelivent. It again only highlights your lack of logic. Because the majority share the same religious views, it MUST be right.

I can tell you're a smart one.
 9 years ago '04        #84
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 r a n c i d said:
That's exactly what i'm saying.

Numbers are irrelivent. It again only highlights your lack of logic. Because the majority share the same religious views, it MUST be right.

I can tell you're a smart one.
Listen you numbskull. I said 90% of the world. You think 90% of the world believes in the same religion? Of course not. I'm saying that since you say all religion is garbage, that you are saying 90% of the world is wrong for believing in SOME sort of religion. Not simply mine.
 9 years ago '04        #85
persuazion 2 heat pts
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 mista SYN said:
See people would like to say God isn't logical...the idea of a huge arc filled with hundreds of species is illogical, parting the Red Sea is illogical. All logic is, is something that makes sense to us. Faith isn't logic, how many times has a miracle occurred that we've witnessed or heard about? Yet, there is no logical way to explain it. Why is it when things go bad, you always here pray for me, or God help us all. Not believing in God, is like saying If I'm sick don't go to the Doctor, I won't get worse since I don't know what is wrong with me. Last point of thought, I always hear about why Jesus is soooo cruel. How can he allow people to die? What is failed to realize is that we are all here on loan. We were born sinners and sinners are already on the path of condemnation. However, the only way to not fall down that path is to accept the blood of Christ. Jesus is not going to force us to love him, as is evident here, because that would be a form of r*pe...which is why he gave us free will. So I guess everything I'm saying now, is simply going to go in one ear and out the other, but you do you and I'll do me, and we'll find out at the end of the tunnel to see who's right. Once again, you want proof of God's existance, I want proof he doesn't exist!!
you mean" billions" of species on the arc? And how is not believing in God like being sick and not going to the doctor?And what makes a miracle to you? What miracles have you witnessed? Im sure it wasnt hard to believe back in the day with red seas parting and Jesus walking on water and God talking to everybody.But that strangly doesnt happen nowadays......now a miracle has been bumped down to winning the lottery,or surviving a car crash,or seeing Jesus's face on a frying pan....God sure did make it easy for everyone when he first came out....now its just the "faith" issue. And I love it when people use the "I want proof he doesn't exist!" excuse. So now its up to us to disprove everything in the world that doesnt exist just so you wont believe in it? Do I have to disprove bigfoot and jack in the beanstalk and Zeus too? Since when does not being able to prove something doesnt exist make it fact and logical to believe in it? Ok I believe in the flying spaghetti monster and choose to worship it.......disprove it....show me actual proof that a flying spaghetti monster doesnt exist or else that means it does and im right.
 9 years ago '04        #86
persuazion 2 heat pts
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:
Listen you numbskull. I said 90% of the world. You think 90% of the world believes in the same religion? Of course not. I'm saying that since you say all religion is garbage, that you are saying 90% of the world is wrong for believing in SOME sort of religion. Not simply mine.
and only 33% believe your version of it......so that makes a WHOLE lot of people going to hell.....I guess your just one of the lucky chosen ones huh?. Poor little tribal kids.......they never had a chance.
 02-10-2009, 11:25 AM         #87
jataylorlfc  OP
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:


If I believe in God and I'm wrong...oh well, I lived a good life.

If you don't believe in God and you're wrong, then you're pretty much fu*ked.
and youre setting the rules?

u think god would punish those who had led a good life and didnt believe him or the mass murderers who completely and whole heartedly believed in him?
 9 years ago '04        #88
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 persuazion said:
No I dont expect everybody to just drop their beliefs and believe what I do.But I do expect Government and Religion to become completey seperated.But I know that will not happen anytime soon.A president who is non Religious would not have a chance becuase alot people think the same way you do.....no religion= no morals. Which is just absurd to me.Maybe Bush wouldnt have sent all those troops to die if he dident believe in heaven and doing gods work. And is it really freedom of religion if babies are dragged to church and put in bible school and taught to pray before they eat and pray before they go to sleep? I know you realize that it is really all up to where you where born.If you where born in Iraq you most likely would have become a Muslim.If you where born into a Mormon family then that that is most likely what you would want to practice.Sure you can break off and convert but you are risking family and neighbor alienation when you do that.....so thats why most people just roll with it rather then become the black sheep.Your right....most of the world does believe in some sort of religion.. from aliens to virgin births to people flying up to heaven on flying horses...but in 1990 the US nonreligious poplulation was 7.5% now its 16.1%. Which tells me we are on the right track. It will take some time but eventually religion will be seen as barbaric mythology......which it is.
I see your argument. But I don't agree with it. Everyone has free choice. Yea parents take their kids to church. But like me, I stopped going for a long time. And you're not automatically alienated from friends and family. Blood is blood.

I don't necessarily believe no religon = no morals. I tried to clear that up in the last post.

What I'm saying is that if you don't want to believe in God, then don't. Period. I hate those bible thumpers too. I said before, I believe religion should be like a job fair. You can walk around to each booth, and pick up info on whatever one you like.

I agree the forcefullness of religion is overboard and people should be free to make their own decission. But I also believe, that a world w/o religion would be much worse off.

Oh and about Moses and the arc, splitting the red sea, sacrificial law, etc. Pretty much the old testement was created for a particular group of people who lived during a particular time. Society is not the same now as it was back then. Rules for that time are irrelevant now. Also, keep in mind the idea of symbolizm. That's what I was saying by taking the bible literally. There's tonz of symbolizm in the bible and you can't take everything at face value.
 9 years ago '04        #89
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 jataylorlfc said:
and youre setting the rules?

u think god would punish those who had led a good life and didnt believe him or the mass murderers who completely and whole heartedly believed in him?
Not at all. That wasn't scripture that I said. It was one of those cliche filler statements. I don't make the rules. If you try and live a good life, who knows, I'm not the one to judge. But i do know, that if you consciously do evil in the world, you don't get a free pass just cuz you say, sorry God forgive me.
 9 years ago '04        #90
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 persuazion said:
and only 33% believe your version of it......so that makes a WHOLE lot of people going to hell.....I guess your just one of the lucky chosen ones huh?. Poor little tribal kids.......they never had a chance.
Please tell me what my version is? I'd love for you to tell me. Seeing on how I believe that God, Allah, etc, are all the same person or thing and that every religion has the same underlying truth. LOL @ tribal little kids. Son I've prolly been going to church more years than you've been on this earth.
 9 years ago '04        #91
HHS 1 heat pts
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:
Against a prevailing view that eighteenth-century Americans had not perpetuated the first settlers' passionate commitment to their faith, scholars now identify a high level of religious energy in colonies after 1700. According to one expert, religion was in the "ascension rather than the declension"; another sees a "rising vitality in religious life" from 1700 onward; a third finds religion in many parts of the colonies in a state of "feverish growth." Figures on church attendance and church formation support these opinions. Between 1700 and 1740, an estimated 75 to 80 percent of the population attended churches, which were being built at a headlong pace.

Toward mid-century the country experienced its first major religious revival. The Great Awakening swept the English-speaking world, as religious energy vibrated between England, Wales, Scotland and the American colonies in the 1730s and 1740s. In America, the Awakening signaled the advent of an encompassing evangelicalism--the belief that the essence of religious experience was the "new birth," inspired by the preaching of the Word. It invigorated even as it divided churches. The supporters of the Awakening and its evangelical thrust--Presbyterians, Baptists and Methodists--became the largest American Protestant denominations by the first decades of the nineteenth century. Opponents of the Awakening or those split by it--Anglicans, Quakers, and Congregationalists--were left behind.
Founded as a majority Christian country, and founded based upon Christian beliefs are not the same thing.

Most intellegent post thus far. :applause: But this president as well talks to the same imaginary figure in the sky. And don't get it twisted. It's not like Christians are schizophrenic. Through prayer and "talking to imaginary figures in the sky" one seeks to find the answers within him/herself. It's not like we actually hear a voice from the clouds saying, go bomb that country. (Well some might, but that's not the overall aspect of religion). Religion is not a static, unconscious following of teachings of man. It's a dynamic relationship with yourself, God, and our world. People find solace and comfort in prayer, which in turn leads to them evaluating their own opinions and actions.
I'm not inside anyone's head to know how the process works for them, but I do wonder where the prayer as meditation ends, and someone crosses over into other territory. More than the internal process, whatever it is, it is the public side of that example that worries me. Because people have been so indoctrinated into these beliefs, I think it psychologically adds credence to someone's words, in the eyes of many people, to proclaim this faith. I think it can put weight on a shared faith, where logic rest instead, on decisions that effect everyone. And yes, Obama has been fairly strong in showing his faith as well, and it's one of a number of things that makes me wary.


Last edited by HHS; 02-10-2009 at 11:54 AM..
 9 years ago '04        #92
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 HHS said:
Founded as a majority Christian country, and founded based upon Christian beliefs are not the same thing.



I'm not inside anyone's head to know how the process works for them, but I do wonder where the prayer as meditation ends, and someone crosses over into other territory. More than the internal process, whatever it is, it is the public side of that example that worries me. Because people have been so indoctrinated into these beliefs, I think it psychologically adds credence to someone's words, in the eyes of many people, to proclaim this faith. I think it can put weight on a shared faith, where logic rest instead, on decisions that effect everyone. And yes, Obama has been fairly strong in showing his faith as well, and it's one of a number of things that makes me wary.
I agree that many people proclaim their faith in an attempt to appear holier than thou or whatever. Which is wrong. Only thing I can say is that it's impossible to say all or every for anything.

I agree religion has been bastardized. And I agree that many MANY people use religion for the wrong initiatives. BUT, for some, hopefully the majority, religion is just a part of their lives, and their faith does provide a positive aspect to their life.

I think that my personal beliefs allow me to think this way, because I'm not 100% in line with many religious institutions.

I recommend the book, "A New Earth" by Ekhart Toole. It goes beneath all the bullsh*t that has clouded religion and ties together the essence of all religions. It's an awesome book, and don't worry it's not bible thumper by any means.
 9 years ago '04        #93
persuazion 2 heat pts
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:
Please tell me what my version is? I'd love for you to tell me. Seeing on how I believe that God, Allah, etc, are all the same person or thing and that every religion has the same underlying truth. LOL @ tribal little kids. Son I've prolly been going to church more years than you've been on this earth.
SO your not really a Christian? God and Allah have 2 sep stories....yes all religions are based on a higher power but if you believe in the Christian God but dont believe in the bible and the way Christians say the world was created then why even follow a specific religion at all?......why not just say you believe in a higher power and thats it? How can you just pick one of the stories and go with it?I know you said that you dont believe that everything in the bible is fact but it is supposed to be the word of God.....are you going against the word of God and saying that maybe the Qu'ran or another religions version of the story is right? Im a grown man not a little kid....and I dont doubt that you have been to church often....that is how you became this way.
 02-10-2009, 12:11 PM         #94
Zlane  OP
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2009 and people still cling to fairytales
 9 years ago '04        #95
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 persuazion said:
SO your not really a Christian? God and Allah have 2 sep stories....yes all religions are based on a higher power but if you believe in the Christian God but dont believe in the bible and the way Christians say the world was created then why even follow a specific religion at all?......why not just say you believe in a higher power and thats it? How can you just pick one of the stories and go with it?I know you said that you dont believe that everything in the bible is fact but it is supposed to be the word of God.....are you going against the word of God and saying that maybe the Qu'ran or another religions version of the story is right? Im a grown man not a little kid....and I dont doubt that you have been to church often....that is how you became this way.
If you would really like for me to explain my entire spirituality to you, send me a pm. I'm not going against the word of God, but do I think that the Qu'ran and the Bible have some of the same underlying truths....most definitely. You're not a Christian, so how can you be the one to tell me if I'm a good Christian or not based on my own life experiences? You keep trying to poke holes in my story, but you don't even know what my story is.

Basically, let me just say this, do I think that any 1 particular religion is 100% right and has everything figured out perfectly? NO.

I know it's hard for people to grasp or accept the notion that they are not in complete control of their own lives.
 02-10-2009, 12:32 PM         #96
r a n c i d  OP
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 ItAlY2BkLyN said:
Listen you numbskull. I said 90% of the world. You think 90% of the world believes in the same religion? Of course not. I'm saying that since you say all religion is garbage, that you are saying 90% of the world is wrong for believing in SOME sort of religion. Not simply mine.
No, but 90% of the world is religious.

What religion is irrelivent to me. They're mainly the same thing. Obviously you'd like to live in a fairytale world where they're each religion is a polar opposite to help your argument, but sadly that's not true.
 9 years ago '04        #97
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 r a n c i d said:
No, but 90% of the world is religious.

What religion is irrelivent to me. They're mainly the same thing. Obviously you'd like to live in a fairytale world where they're each religion is a polar opposite to help your argument, but sadly that's not true.
:wtf: did you just say?

you make no sense. How would that help my argument?
 02-10-2009, 12:53 PM         #98
AlexG1989  OP
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Ok well this country has the freedom of religion. That is to practice or not practice any of your choice. BUT this country was founded upon Christian beliefs. Just because YOU don't believe in God, doesn't mean that everyone else has to accomodate you by changing the money we've used for 100s of years, etc. You think that just because you don't belive in God, everyone else is supposed to change their beliefs?
I stopped reading your post right after you said that. Learn about history before you start talking like you know something...
 9 years ago '04        #99
ItAlY2BkLyN 238 heat pts238
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 AlexG1989 said:
I stopped reading your post right after you said that. Learn about history before you start talking like you know something...
Refer to the prior post or provide some sort of evidence that I'm wrong or shut up because your post contributed nothing to this thread.

So far HHS is the only person who argued with me that I give any credit to. You guys could learn something from him.


Last edited by ItAlY2BkLyN; 02-10-2009 at 01:01 PM..
 02-10-2009, 02:18 PM         #100
TheCityOnMyMind  OP
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I am god!!!
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